Is RIM Trying to Go Under?

[npro1464]

I thought it was weird that with the Android manufacturers pumping out faster and more powerful phones that Research in Motion seems dead at the wheel with their outdated Blackberry lineup. The Playbook at least looked like an attempt to regain some relevancy, and perhaps a phone like it would help bring back the once leader in smart phones. Then I saw this:

Bing Becomes Default Search & Maps on BlackBerry Phones, Deeply Integrated in OS

Bing?!?! What are they trying to compete with, the Samsung Fascinate? Can you change the default search provider or will that be restricted? Why are these companies like Nokia and RIM turning to Microsoft of all companies while the mobile market is leaving them in the dust? Microsoft has a worse mobile platform then both of them!

Call me a cynic, I don't see this helping Blackberry, in fact I think this will have an opposite effect. I think RIM made just made it real easy for me to decide on what kind of phone I wont be purchasing with my next upgrade.

 

[Guamguy]

Doesn't matter one bit. Blackberry --- and Nokia ---, usually use Yahoo as a default. Given that Yahoo is now powered by Bing, this doesn't really change the status quo.

Google always prevails whether or not whatever the platform uses a default search. I mean like Windows right? With default browser it always points to Bing anyway.

Blackberry and Nokia users usually just end up downloading the faster Opera Mini or Opera Mobile anyway for their browsing use. Guess what, Opera is fixed to using Google for search. You see, Google probably gives Opera a commission on searches.

And it won't matter really. If Google is paying the carrier a commission on searches, the carrier can still override the default search by requesting the phone maker to bundle Google's search app.

Google's Search app is available in Nokia's OVI store, Blackberry App World, and even on Windows Phone 7 Marketplace.

RIM---and Microsoft---is stupid. You should not integrate search apps into the operating system. It is just plain stupid. Why?

In order to upgrade the search, guess what, you need to upgrade the OS. Ironically, Bing apps on Android and iPhone look nicer than on Windows Phone 7, because as an app, Bing is updated separately, and more frequently without being tied to an OS update.

Google has learned this lesson. Google Search was OS integrated up to Android 2.1. From Android 2.2, it has been decoupled into an app, where it can have separate updates in the Market independent of OS updates. Likewise, the app decoupling also happened with GMail and YouTube. Google Maps and Android Market themselves are OS decoupled since Android 1.6.

 

[Guamguy]

Let me add:

In any case, Blackberry's strategy is strange. RIM threw three bones for Android too: Playbook compatibility, BES support for Android and BBM for Android.

You get the impression RIM is trying to balance out Microsoft and Google, but in effect, I think they're just cutting their own neck.

In any case, something ominous is on the horizon --- Facebook. Facebook recently bought Beluga, which has group messaging (BBM like) app on the iPhone App Store and Android Market. The intention is clear: put group chat into Facebook mobile apps and into the main web app. That is going to immediately obsolete Blackberry Messenger, which is one of the true killer apps for Blackberry.

 

[FitGuyGE8]

Blackberry people are hardcore... to the bone. RIM could press release their newest offering rapes children, hardcore "crackberry" addicts will still want nothing to do w/ iPhone or Android OS devices...

The few people I've come in contact with that have switched from a Blackberry device to an Android OS device hate it. They bitch and moan about how different it is & how much they liked their Blackberry and usually, eventually go back to a Blackberry device...

However, I have found once you go iPhone in black you never go back... lolz/jk

 

[novox77]

Anyone remember Sega? They realized they were losing the console war. So they dropped consoles and started focusing on games for all platforms. I think RIM might be thinking the same thing... how to leverage what they have and continue to make money off it. Some day they may no longer make phones, but others may still use their services.

 

[Vihzel]

RIM is incredibly puzzling to me and don't understand where they're going with their upcoming phones. They release things SO slowly and have a tendency to be outdated. They're not Apple where they can easily afford to release once a year. RIM should shake things up at the top. The biggest thing they need is a revamp of their OS to make it more user friendly.

 

[Outlaw71]

RIM threw their hat into the ring in the superphone wars with the 'Storm/Storm2', and failed miserably to even put a dent in Apples iPhones sales. Then Android came along and hit Apple square in the teeth like a 50 car freight train slamming into a semi-truck stuck on the railroad tracks. If they couldn't out do the iPhone, what chance did they have competing head to head against Android??? IMO that was when RIM realized they were going to have to go in a different direction.

That different direction was to just keep being RIM instead of trying to be Apple/Android. For the market they are in, nobody can touch RIM. The 'Droid Pro' is no more a Blackberry killer than the 'Storm' was an iPhone killer. There's an old saying, 'stick to doing what you do best'. RIM makes business phones that dabble in social media. Android makes social media phones that dabble in business.

When you look at the cellular landscape over the past 10 years, Nokia once owned the whole world, but is losing ground faster than the Russians did during Blitzkrieg. Apple leapfrogged their way up the charts overnight, but is now back sliding some. Android is moving up the food chain like a Great White shark in the Pacific ocean. But RIM attained a percentage of the market over the years, and has held that share for the most part.

They aren't going anywhere because nobody is challenging them in their sector. Motorola threw the Droid Pro out there, but they're the only one who's even tried, and it was a pretty huge flop. RIM knows this much, the cellphone market will never be a 'one size fits all' entity. They are pretty solid with what they have and they know it. They don't have to rush a whole bunch of new devices out like Android is doing because business people aren't so much into upgrading to the 'latest and greatest' every 6 months. They are much more interested in finding something that works, and sticking with it.

And that's what RIM gives them. They've perfected the business phone to a science, so now you don't see tons of different Blackberry devices flooding the market anymore. They just keep churning out their proven business devices quarter after quarter. And professionals everywhere just keep picking them up because for what they need, and for what they use a device for... RIM has the market cornered.

 

[npro1464]

RIM threw their hat into the ring in the superphone wars with the 'Storm/Storm2', and failed miserably to even put a dent in Apples iPhones sales. Then Android came along and hit Apple square in the teeth like a 50 car freight train slamming into a semi-truck stuck on the railroad tracks. If they couldn't out do the iPhone, what chance did they have competing head to head against Android??? IMO that was when RIM realized they were going to have to go in a different direction.

That different direction was to just keep being RIM instead of trying to be Apple/Android. For the market they are in, nobody can touch RIM. The 'Droid Pro' is no more a Blackberry killer than the 'Storm' was an iPhone killer. There's an old saying, 'stick to doing what you do best'. RIM makes business phones that dabble in social media. Android makes social media phones that dabble in business.

When you look at the cellular landscape over the past 10 years, Nokia once owned the whole world, but is losing ground faster than the Russians did during Blitzkrieg. Apple leapfrogged their way up the charts overnight, but is now back sliding some. Android is moving up the food chain like a Great White shark in the Pacific ocean. But RIM attained a percentage of the market over the years, and has held that share for the most part.

They aren't going anywhere because nobody is challenging them in their sector. Motorola threw the Droid Pro out there, but they're the only one who's even tried, and it was a pretty huge flop. RIM knows this much, the cellphone market will never be a 'one size fits all' entity. They are pretty solid with what they have and they know it. They don't have to rush a whole bunch of new devices out like Android is doing because business people aren't so much into upgrading to the 'latest and greatest' every 6 months. They are much more interested in finding something that works, and sticking with it.

And that's what RIM gives them. They've perfected the business phone to a science, so now you don't see tons of different Blackberry devices flooding the market anymore. They just keep churning out their proven business devices quarter after quarter. And professionals everywhere just keep picking them up because for what they need, and for what they use a device for... RIM has the market cornered.

I disagree. More and more businesses are allowing Android smartphones to be used for work phones. I predict in the future that Android will own this segment as well.

They do have some following for non-business users, particularly teens. Some people just prefer the Blackberry experience. If they just tried to develop and refine their phones they may be able to compete. But looking at their upcoming lineup, I'm not impressed. All of their new phones are basically refurbished old phones. They never seem to innovate and come out with something new. Now they are going to integrate a crappy search engine into their OS, why?!?! Maybe I am speaking for myself, but when I check out a phone at the Verizon store and I see that stupid "Bing" search bar, I cringe, out it down, and pass it. I'm sure I'm not alone. This will alienate their base.

As Android users, we have to hope that the competition for Android remains stiff. Apple will always be there, but will RIM? Will Nokia? Will Windows Phone 7? At this point I'd answer: no, maybe as a manufacturer of Android phones, and no, Windows "Smart Phones for people who don't give a crap about smart phones" platform will fizzle into obscurity.

 

[takeshi]

I thought it was weird that with the Android manufacturers pumping out faster and more powerful phones that Research in Motion seems dead at the wheel with their outdated Blackberry lineup.

How is it weird? That has been a criticism of RIM for far longer than Android has even been in existence.

Why are these companies like Nokia and RIM turning to Microsoft of all companies while the mobile market is leaving them in the dust? Microsoft has a worse mobile platform then both of them!

Why do forum users seem to think that all companies should use the approach that the forum user prefers? Differentiation and options are a plus in the free market. What's better or worse is highly subjective. What you find better/worse isn't necessarily what the next person finds to be better/worse. Be careful with that tunnel vision.

 

[pantlesspenguin]

Blackberry people are hardcore... to the bone. RIM could press release their newest offering rapes children, hardcore "crackberry" addicts will still want nothing to do w/ iPhone or Android OS devices...

The few people I've come in contact with that have switched from a Blackberry device to an Android OS device hate it. They bitch and moan about how different it is & how much they liked their Blackberry and usually, eventually go back to a Blackberry device...

However, I have found once you go iPhone in black you never go back... lolz/jk

Yep, blackberry addicts are pretty hardcore. Android is a ban-worthy name in some cases on crackberry.com, depending on what kind of post you make. However, also on crackberry.com is an Android section, full of users that have happily switched over. The majority of the people who stay on that site like the community & have made friends there, but also frequent other Android sites like this one. Of course you see posts where people try out Android & immediately switch back...but the reasons are typically user error, or they didn't take the time to get over the learning curve of a new OS.

All of their new phones are basically refurbished old phones. They never seem to innovate and come out with something new.

Actually, the new Bold w/ the touch screen is pretty innovative, as far as RIM is concerned. I know other phones have done it before, but people have been clammoring for this type of blackberry for years. And, that's the problem. This phone has essentially been in talks for nearly TWO YEARS.

http://forums.crackberry.com/f235/blackberry-magnum-dakota-177083/

That was well before Android got big. If they would have released this back then, it would've been huge. And, like Outlaw said, if only the Storm series wasn't a huge flop, they could have been awesome.

Edited to add: They also made the same mistake w/ the Torch & Playbook. They took WAY too long before the rumors/announcement & the actual release. In that time, other products totally pass those rumored devices by, so they're pretty much DOA when released, & only the hardcore RIM fanatics go for them.

 

[alostpacket]

Anyone remember Sega? They realized they were losing the console war. So they dropped consoles and started focusing on games for all platforms. I think RIM might be thinking the same thing... how to leverage what they have and continue to make money off it. Some day they may no longer make phones, but others may still use their services.

I think this^ sums it up perfectly. They are still huge among kids for the chat room style messaging. And they still have some business-stlye image they can exploit.

But I'd say they are considering very carefully how to carve the market to their advantage rather than throwing all they can at directly competing with Google and Apple.

 

[FitGuyGE8]

...Then Android came along and hit Apple square in the teeth... IMO that was when RIM realized they were going to have to go in a different direction.

...For the market they are in, nobody can touch RIM...RIM makes business phones that dabble in social media. Android makes social media phones that dabble in business.

They aren't going anywhere because nobody is challenging them in their sector...They are pretty solid with what they have and they know it. They don't have to rush a whole bunch of new devices out like Android is doing because business people aren't so much into upgrading to the 'latest and greatest' every 6 months...

...you don't see tons of different Blackberry devices flooding the market anymore. They just keep churning out their proven business devices quarter after quarter. And professionals everywhere just keep picking them up because for what they need, and for what they use a device for... RIM has the market cornered.

Uh...No... Just No... Android has been steadily moving up in market share yes, but a strong hit to Apple profits hardly. RIM has never gone in "another direction"... Ever... If you look at any leaked info on future business plans they run the same as they have for years...

Apple is touching RIM... All over their naughty places. If you research a bit into business enterprise markets you'll find Apple is consistently taking market share from RIM in that sector. Yes, RIM dabbles in social networking & entertainment. But, that is Android's only conquest. You'll be extremely hard pressed to find any devices running Android on a business model/IT structure for any company, big or small.

Again, Apple is consistently taking RIM market share in the enterprize sector. Executives like iPhones, I know because I service them and have serviced them. More and more, IT peoples are hearing the big wigs ask, "Can we get iPhones on this server?" At least with the vast majority of companies my friends and I have worked for & serviced. RIM knows this, they are worried... And the only reason you are seeing a flood of Android devices on the general market is that there are a plethora of manufacturers making Android devices due to the fact it is mostly open source. Only Apple makes iPhone. Only RIM makes Blackberry. Business professionals I am in contact with have more of a concern with fragmentation along the platform & the lack of support for the devices, not the fact that Google wants to roll out a new OS every 6 months.

RIM is losing market share. They are turning to whoever they can to get it back. They can't turn to Cupertino, that's for sure. They can't become another manufacturer of Moutain View products in the vast sea of phone makers there already is and still remain viable to investors, and they really don't want to make anything but Blackberry OS devices. They're not going to make a Windows Mobile device like Nokia plans on, but they sure will take whatever help and money they can get from Microsoft.

IMO, Your post is full of holes like a piece of Swiss cheese... Or RIMS forthcoming business plans if you prefer...

 

[mplevy]

Funny that I was reading this.. I just got off the phone with one of my users, he has a Storm, wants an iPhone.

I can see Android and iPhone taking over in the Enterprise sector, but Android has some work to do in the security segment. I know the company I support isn't allowing Android yet, because the server can't get the OS version information from the device without 3rd-party software that they are currently testing. A HUGE plus for Android and iOS in the enterprise segment is cost of admission on the server side since they use EAS rather than requiring a BES.