Windows 8 vs. Android on tablets

[huy_lonewolf]

Hi guys,
I know the discussion about Windows 8 vs. Android has been going on for a while, but I think it's worth discussing now due to the introduction of Windows 8 Consumer Preview at Mobile World Congress 2012.
I just want to know your opinions on the upcoming Windows 8 on ARM (WOA) in comparison with Android. The battle for tablet supremacy has always been the battle between Android and iOS, but I believe it is going to change soon with WOA. As demonstrated by Microsoft at MWC 2012, Windows 8 utilizes the same SOCs that most Android phones currently use (namely Snapdragon, Tegra and OMAP). From what I have seen, windows 8 is significantly smoother than Android on the same hardware (web browsing particularly).

Most importantly, the best feature that Windows 8 has over android is multitasking. Currently, even on my Transformer Prime with ICS, there is no way that I can watch a Youtube videos and chat at the same time. You can imagine how inconvenient it is when you have to stop your video in order to reply people. In Windows 8, you can place apps side by side, which is just right.

In terms of media playback, Windows 8 has this Microsoft Media Foundation, which allegedly is a lot better than anything currently available on Android. I don't have to worry about forcing hardware acceleration when playing videos, you can just play anything.

A minor point but very important for me, I cannot copy any file larger than 4 GB to any Android tablets, but windows 8 can 'cause it has native support for NTFS file system.

Lastly, Windows 8 tablets can connect to many other products, one being printers.

In the past, all of those arguments may be invalid because it is an unfair comparison between desktop OS and mobile OS. However, if Microsoft can really deliver such desktop experience on ARM tablets, I will be having a really hard time finding a good reason to choose an Android tablet over a Windows 8 tablet. The most obvious advantage Android currently holds over Windows 8 is the fact that Android has a lot more apps as well as better battery performance.

As an Android enthusiast, I really fear that Windows 8, to say the least, will eat up a huge portion of Android tablets' market share. Do you think that Android will have a chance against windows 8 on ARM? I am hoping someone can prove me wrong.

 

[jerofld]

I don't fear it. Windows 8 tablets are projected to cost $700+. Android has been able to grab so much of the market share due to cheaper handsets being able to install it. This goes for tablets, as well.

Honestly, Apple should be afraid of Windows 8 more so than Google. Google's Nexus tablet is evidence of this. Google's Nexus Tablet isn't an iPad killer...they're designing it to compete with the Kindle Fire.

 

[chanchan05]

If windows enters the tablet race, its Apple that should fear. The capabilities of Windows makes it impossible to use for cheaper devices, so Android will maintain that market. At the top end of the price range where.you find Windows and Apple along with high end Android tablets, Windows win in features and possible running of true desktop apps. The only thing that I see keeping Apple in the race at all is the fact that they have been successful in brain washing so many people.

 

[350X]

Yep ^ let Apple worry, Android is safe n secure like he was tuck in by his Mommy.

Apple will always be a trendy device for those that think its hip, but thats about it. Feel so bad for GF son who has bought into it some and had to have a $200+ ipod touch.
[while he still has a 99cent freebie cell phone]

Could of got an Andriod cell and a tablet.

 

[Stuntman]

I don't care what OS the tablet runs. I want a spreadsheet app that provides an experience that approaches Excel on my PC. So far, I tried Polaris office and Google docs on my Eee Pad Transformer with keyboard dock. Both of those spreadsheet apps suck big time.

I'm thinking that with Win8, they may have a decent version of Excel for the tablet.

 

[350X]

I don't care what OS the tablet runs. I want a spreadsheet app that provides an experience that approaches Excel on my PC. So far, I tried Polaris office and Google docs on my Eee Pad Transformer with keyboard dock. Both of those spreadsheet apps suck big time.

I'm thinking that with Win8, they may have a decent version of Excel for the tablet.

^ id bet you could find a way to get a version to run on Android but it would be a 1 off project, probably licensing issues in the way

 

[chanchan05]

They won't have just a decent version of excel, from what I heard they're going to put full MS Office into Win8 for tablets.

 

[huy_lonewolf]

Ya, Microsoft has already announced that they will have a full-feature Office on Windows 8 on ARM. I am hoping the next version of Android (Jelly Bean?) will have features to make tablets more functional.

 

[ari-free]

If Windows 8 means you can have all the PC apps and games (especially games) then it would be something else. But if it's just Microsoft apps plus a lot of .NET stuff (since this will be based on ARM and not x86) then I think it will be another WinMo again. The fact that WinMo had MS Office on it wasn't enough to save it.

 

[chanchan05]

Windows 8 does not mean that you can have all PC programs and games, since the programs would have to be optimized for ARM, and a lot of PC programs aren't. Unlike WinMo which was based on the same Windows CE for Desktop, I hear that Win8 for tablets was built from ground-up like WP7 was, so it will be optimized apps for it, instead of ported programs.

You could probably run emulators on it though.

 

[mikedt]

I do believe Windows 8 on ARM tablets is going to be a locked-in walled garden app store, approved Metro apps only, rather like iPad. Don't want that, rather have Android. Plus at $700 USD a device, which is more expensive than the iPad...OK.. we'll see...oh yeh competing with all those $100-$200 Shenzhen China Pads as well.

You could probably run emulators on it though.

Sorry no emulators... approved apps only.

In tech news next year 2013... Windows 8 jailbreak.

 

[chanchan05]

I do believe Windows 8 on ARM tablets is going to be a locked-in walled garden app store, approved Metro apps only, rather like iPad. Don't want that, rather have Android. Plus at $700 USD a device, which is more expensive than the iPad...OK.. we'll see...oh yeh competing with all those $100-$200 Shenzhen China Pads as well.




Sorry no emulators... approved apps only.

In tech news next year 2013... Windows 8 jailbreak.

Doesn't even iOS have emulators? Like GB emulators and stuff? Windows has been running emulators for years, I don't see why they won't approve of stuff like that. And while Windows may become a closed garden type with only approved apps coming in, from their open letters to developers they seem to be giving them a lot of freedom except with regards to UI design (which isn't really too much of a bad thing).

Personally though, I probably won't be even looking at a Windows Tablet for at least the next two years to give it time to grow. I was never an early adopter.

 

[droogie2799]

If microsoft creates an OS that can run on tablets and have that tablet integrated into enterprise management solutions (SCCM) MS wins big time. Currently there are many project being driven by iPads and Android tablets but the biggest problem is manageability.

Although android would still grab the "cheaper" market and iPad would grab the trendy market, I can see an MS tablet with full management capabilities winning the market share.

 

[EarlyMon]

Office has driven a lot of pc sales.

Compatible apps like Documents to Go and OfficeSuite on Android will probably continue to improve. Meanwhile, while not for everyone, this is interesting -

Onlive Desktop Now Available For Android Tablets – Your Own Personal Windows 7 PC In The Cloud For Free

Microsoft has already levied the requirement that tablets for the new os have a locked and encrypted bootloader. Microsoft has made clear that they want no custom mods on their tablets. Any modding will be limited by that.

For the past 5 years, I have gotten excited about Windows tablets previews and rumors, thinking that this is the year I'll pick one up for work. Then they come out, and I shake my head and wait another year.

Parts of Windows 8 sounds great on paper. And every year, Balmer promises Wall Street that this is the year that people will buy Windows tablets.

What sounds even better is that HTC and now Samsung have figured out that a proper stylus can matter a lot for business use.

Android tablets have been characterized by minimum hardware to meet specs at maximum prices. More ram, more storage, lower prices please.

 

[ari-free]

Office sells PC's but PC's are meant for actual work. You don't get a tablet for serious editing jobs. Tablets have to be fun. Office can make a fun tablet more useful but if all they are offering is Office and monochromatic icons then I don't think they'll be very popular.

I think their biggest mistake was letting the Zune guys come up with WP7 instead of their Xbox team. An xbox phone/tablet with AAA games would have been awesome. ooooh Halo on your tablet! But no. All we got were homebrew XDA games that you could get anywhere.

 

[mikedt]

Doesn't even iOS have emulators? Like GB emulators and stuff?

You can have some emulators on iOS, but seems to be tight restrictions and rules on what they can do. e.g. not allowed free access to BASIC in C64 emulators and other 8-bit computer emulators.
C64 taken down from the App Store due to BASIC glitch | C64 news | iPhone | Pocket Gamer
Probably has something to do with Apple prohibiting programming and software development apps on iOS devices.

 

[scooterinmn]

I am the director of IT at my company. A couple of years ago, we migrated everyone from BB and a couple of rouge iPhone users to Android. I also got the execs that travel Xooms. Needless to say that I was an instant hero with everyone after this but the common complaint that I get from EVERYONE is "were is my MS Office?" and "why can't I have spell check?"

You can bet that when these tablets are released, I will be putting these Xooms on eBay. Sorry Google but some folks use these for work too! I am very excited about the new Windows OS and the benefits to my more mobile users!

 

[EarlyMon]

We have a classified forum for you if you want to consider it when the time comes. Plus, it's free.

Too bad OfficeSuite or Documents to Go didn't work out for you.

 

[mikedt]

I am the director of IT at my company. A couple of years ago, we migrated everyone from BB and a couple of rouge iPhone users to Android. I also got the execs that travel Xooms. Needless to say that I was an instant hero with everyone after this but the common complaint that I get from EVERYONE is "were is my MS Office?" and "why can't I have spell check?"

A problem I run into with MS Office alternatives is document compatibility, specifically PEP textbook CD-ROM PowerPoint PPTs, that have a mix of English and Chinese text. I use these in the classroom everyday. Often the Chinese text is misplaced, misaligned or is just unreadable. I need MS PowerPoint, that's it, accept no substitute..

 

[EarlyMon]

The mobile space is plagued by the font set that tries to treat Korean, Japanese and Chinese within the same package. Dumb move, drives a lot of people crazy, I agree.

 

[mikedt]

There's a couple more serous font related issues I've found with mobile, specifically Android.
1. Incomplete and broken International Phonetic Alphabet(IPA). There was an AF thread about this last year.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_phonetic_alphabet
2. No support at all for Mongolian script. I'm in a Mongolian school, many of our materials and documents use this. Also Mongolian is written vertically, top-to-bottom, Android doesn't support this anyway. Often has difficulty with right-to-left languages, like Hebrew and Arabic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongolian_script

Basically I've got to have MS Windows here.

 

[mrspeedmaster]

WOA will be DOA. The appeal of W8 on a tablet was the ability to run legacy apps or have the ability to easily port existing w32 apps to ARM.
That is not the case anymore.

Steven Sinofsky, Windows 8 Boss, penned the famous blog post detailing WOA (WIndows on ARM).

source: Building Windows for the ARM processor architecture - Building Windows 8 - Site Home - MSDN Blogs

The most important quote:

WOA will not support any type of virtualization or emulation approach, and will not enable existing x86/64 applications to be ported or run

More in-depth analysis:
AnandTech - Microsoft Provides Windows on ARM Details
Jeremy Likness' Blog : Windows 8: The Facts about ARM, Metro, and the Blue Stack


http://www.techradar.com/news/softw...ows-8-arm-desktop-no-third-party-apps-1062187


Bottom Line:
Windows 8 (on ARM). The ones that compete w/ iPad and Android in the $500 and under price point will be a hard sell.

It will have a Desktop mode but ONLY Microsft apps - Explorer and Office. All Apps must be re-written in the new wRT API; displacing 15 years of legacy code.
All apps will only be sold in the app store. Nobody can make desktop apps. They all must be WRT.
All Metro apps are ONLY sold through the locked-down, approved MS Store.


.NET and Silverlight apps will not be an easy port. You can't set compiler flag in something like Firefox, Open-Office or VLC and expect it port. You need to dump all w32 libraries and pretty much start from scratch.

Windows x86 versions don't have these restrictions. WOA is strictly metro apps only with a desktop mode for Office/Explorer.

So WOA (Window on ARM) will start w/ a clean slate like iOS and Android. It needs to woo developers to develop Metro Apps (with a new API).

My only guess why they have a desktop mode for WOA is because the Office team coud not port Office to WRT API in time. They have legacy spaghetti code and it will take a while for native Office to WOA.

Without the apps, it will compete on an even field with iOS and Android.

 

[EarlyMon]

OK, that saves me a lot of time. A good wrap on why I won't bother with a Win8 tablet this year.

It's always something with those guys, I swear.

 

[karandpr]

But ARM Tablets are not the only W8 Tablets we will see ,will we ?

What about x86 Clover Trail Tablets running W8 ?
That will be an interesting segment wont it .Probabaly the 700+ Tablets may be x86 . Who knows ?

 

[chanchan05]

There already are existing x86 windows tablets, not to mention the HP T-series with the swivel screens, some MSi Wind series tablets and the Samsungs, all of which are obviously upgradeable to Win8. Any of those would blow current tablets away, if they did not cost almost twice as a 32GB iPad. But then again they do have 200GB HDDs...