Mugen's 6400mAh Note 2 battery...

colnago · Nov 30, 2012

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Who's gonna' "double down"?

http://www.engadget.com/2012/11/30/mugen-power-offers-massive-6-400mah-galaxy-note-ii-battery/

"Is the already insanely long battery life of the*Galaxy Note II*just not enough? Mugen Power's new extended battery might not have Samsung's giant smartphone running forever, but it sure will feel like an eternity. At 6,400mAh, the replacement has more than twice the capacity of the Galaxy Note II's stock 3,100mAh pack while keeping the NFC wireless. Just don't expect to shove the resulting franken-phablet*into a tight pants pocket -- like most such batteries, Mugen's is much thicker than the default and even comes with its own kickstand to save wrist strain during a movie marathon. The pack normally costs $106 and is listed as working with most any Galaxy Note II variant, including at least the American variants for AT&T, Sprint, T-Mobile and US Cellular. Those who can bide their time until the quoted December 21st ship date will end up with a tank of a smartphone, but one that might just last a whole weekend away from a wall outlet."

h1r0ll3r · Nov 30, 2012

A tank indeed. That thing is HUGE! Would be nice to have all that extra juice but the thing looks like a 80's TV remote with that battery in it.

Riverdome · Nov 30, 2012

How thick are we talking here? The picture looks huge but shouldn't it be closer to twice as thick as the current battery?

colnago · Nov 30, 2012

It'll probably add 1-2mm above an additional thickness of an OEM battery. I'll probably break down and get one, just to have for trips.

edlex · Nov 30, 2012

That thing is insane huge! For that much money you can buy 4 oem batteries.

longus catus · Nov 30, 2012

colnago said:
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.
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Who's gonna' "double down"?

"... Mugen's is much thicker than the default and even comes with its own kickstand to save wrist strain during a movie marathon. The pack normally costs $106 and is listed as working with most any Galaxy Note II variant, including at leas...

The last Mugen battery I used a battery analyzer to test was $89, and claimed 4600mAh (for the S3). It performed the same as a $15 4200mAh battery...

That's the S3 extended battery chart... Sorry for bringing up the GS3 into this, but it might be relevant when deciding on whether or not to buy the Mugen battery for the GN2.

colnago · Nov 30, 2012

Fair enough. I wouldn't expect any company, making any product, to be producing at (5) 9s...there are bound to be exceptions. I've hada NIB OEM Motorola battery go bad on me in the first week, as it rebooted the phone every time I preformed a certain task. From various other forums over the years, for various phones, Mugen seems to have a good rep. Personally, I'd sick with them, or Seidio, from personal experience.

longus catus · Dec 5, 2012

colnago said:
Fair enough. I wouldn't expect any company, making any product, to be producing at (5) 9s...there are bound to be exceptions. I've hada NIB OEM Motorola battery go bad on me in the first week, as it rebooted the phone every time I preformed a certain task. From various other forums over the years, for various phones, Mugen seems to have a good rep. Personally, I'd sick with them, or Seidio, from personal experience.

Some companies produce batteries that are over 99.999%, as can be seen from a number of tests in my chart. More than half of the batteries that I tested and showed in that chart provide >= 100%. I won't settle for less than 100% when it's provided by multiple companies that manage to sell it 4 times cheaper than a product that doesn't live up to its claims.

colnago · Dec 5, 2012

longus catus said:
Some companies produce batteries that are over 99.999%, as can be seen from a number of tests in my chart. More than half of the batteries that I tested and showed in that chart provide >= 100%. I won't settle for less than 100% when it's provided by multiple companies that manage to sell it 4 times cheaper than a product that doesn't live up to its claims.

"(5) 9s", referring to a manufacturer's production failure, or system's availability rates...not a given product's performance level.

longus catus · Dec 5, 2012

colnago said:
"(5) 9s", referring to a manufacturer's production failure, or system's availability rates...not a given product's performance level.

Looks like I should RMA it, then.

virodeath · Dec 5, 2012

How about I put some car batteries in series on a dolly, run some jumper cables to the Note 2 and just drag that around with me all day...

Can call it the Mulligan Battery Extender.

Viro

Zatx · Dec 5, 2012

longus catus said:
Some companies produce batteries that are over 99.999%, as can be seen from a number of tests in my chart. More than half of the batteries that I tested and showed in that chart provide >= 100%. I won't settle for less than 100% when it's provided by multiple companies that manage to sell it 4 times cheaper than a product that doesn't live up to its claims.

Hey there. In another thread you said you take requests for battery test. I officially request you test this battery.

Please and thank you!

Zatx · Dec 5, 2012

Here is another image that shows the size better. (clicky for full size!)

$105.00 Retail.

http://www.mugen-power-batteries.co...-samsung-galaxy-note-2-with-battery-door.html

Note 2 · Dec 5, 2012

I bought a note 2 extended battery off of eBay for like $8 shipped. It works ok and is not that huge in the hand. I just can't justify paying mugen 90-100 bucks for this thing. I would rather have 2 stock batteries and the external charger before buying this thing for that price. There was also anker I think who made a note extended battery and I think it came with a silicone type case that wrapped around the front offering lip protection that was kinda nice. I'll see what they offer.

gilbequick · Dec 5, 2012

virodeath said:
How about I put some car batteries in series on a dolly, run some jumper cables to the Note 2 and just drag that around with me all day...

Can call it the Mulligan Battery Extender.

Viro

Because then you'd have way to much voltage and fry your phablet. You meant parallel, but even so 12v is little high. I get your point though, when is enough enough? For a phone, the Note 2 is already a giant. Then you add even more bulk to it and now your back to a Miami Vice sized phone:

Just get an extra stock sized battery and take it when you think you'll need it.

jasaero · Dec 5, 2012

longus catus said:
The last Mugen battery I used a battery analyzer to test was $89, and claimed 4600mAh (for the S3). It performed the same as a $15 4200mAh battery...

That's the S3 extended battery chart... Sorry for bringing up the GS3 into this, but it might be relevant when deciding on whether or not to buy the Mugen battery for the GN2.

Have you done tests like these at higher drain rates?? These things come with 1-2amp chargers now so you know the devices are capably of demanding more than half amp so I would be curious to know how these cheaper batteries hold when getting molested with heavier current draws.

Not bashing your test as 500ma is probably fair for most peoples needs, but heavy users probably need to see how things shift at higher discharge rates. There are also costs associated with battery chemistry that can deal with higher discharge rates without falling down.

longus catus · Dec 5, 2012

jasaero said:
Have you done tests like these at higher drain rates?? These things come with 1-2amp chargers now so you know the devices are capably of demanding more than half amp so I would be curious to know how these cheaper batteries hold when getting molested with heavier current draws.

Not bashing your test as 500ma is probably fair for most peoples needs, but heavy users probably need to see how things shift at higher discharge rates. There are also costs associated with battery chemistry that can deal with higher discharge rates without falling down.

Yes, higher drain rates has been something I've considered. I have some tests done at 2amps. And to be honest, the charts still look very similar, I remember one being like 100-150mAh less at 2000mA vs 500mA. I haven't published any 2A results though.

Batteries are rated at something like 0.2C, or a drain rate of 1/5 of the total capacity, so I think at least a test that represents a 0.2C test should be done along with whatever other test.

I'm going to do more and better tests once I build my 4.35V charger - I will be able to script the tests and just put the battery in the chamber, start the script, and 3 days later, profit. The charger I'm building is based off of some charger from Microchip. I have the parts in transit, etc... I considered hooking up one of those slow ass chargers, but they just take too long. This chip will charge at 1A, so hopefully there will be great success.

longus catus · Dec 5, 2012

Note 2 said:
I bought a note 2 extended battery off of eBay for like $8 shipped. It works ok and is not that huge in the hand. I just can't justify paying mugen 90-100 bucks for this thing. I would rather have 2 stock batteries and the external charger before buying this thing for that price. There was also anker I think who made a note extended battery and I think it came with a silicone type case that wrapped around the front offering lip protection that was kinda nice. I'll see what they offer.

There are good alternatives to a $100 battery. Good quality doesn't *have* to cost an arm and a leg. Giving your arm and a leg doesn't guarantee high quality.

This isn't aimed towards the quoted person...although it might look like it. I know you're not saying some of this stuff...

Sorry to state the obvious, but some people think that since they bought a $5 battery from eBay that sucks, that all third party batteries are like that. And maybe even that going with the most expensive one is the only way to guarantee quality. Maybe denying they chose a poor battery by saying all of the low-cost batteries are bad is how they deal with it.

I reference the GS3 batteries in the following:

Speaking of price/quality relationship, it might not be a surprise, but the cheapest and the most expensive batteries are actually worse than average priced batteries. Not just in value, but in actual capacity. A $5 HaoJetSo is 70% of advertised, a $13 Anker is 98% of advertised, a $20 Hyperion is 100.5% of advertised, a $50 seidio is 97% of advertised (but a poor buy because they sell a 3500mAh battery that's as physically large as a 4500mAh battery), and Mugen is 92% of claimed capacity.

The only exception to that trend is Gorilla Gadgets, who claims 4500mAh, and delivered 4550mAh. I could barely believe my eyes when I saw it. It was $30 when I got it, but recently it's been around $20-$22 or so.

In this sample of 7 batteries (chart from my mugen review), the two lowest delivering (versus claimed) batteries are Onite at 96%, and Mugen at 92%. All the others are 99% or above. Onite was also more expensive when I got it, like $25... and it delivered less.

I haven't tested many extended GN2 batteries yet (just QCell and some generic red and yellow striped battery, and tons of GS3 batteries), but from my previous experience, Hyperion, Anker, EZOPower aren't going to give you the "crappy battery I bought from ebay" treatment.

I'll decide tonight whether or not to get the Mugen battery.

And I hope this post isn't considered off topic.

jasaero · Dec 5, 2012

In all your testing does there seem to be any correlation to apparent build quality and capacity? And do any of them offer a bit better grade cover in the huge ones than others? I have got some that had some very odd build quality aspects like the contacts being of some obviously cheap casting method and such. And had some that came with covers that just fell apart. I agree that these cheap ones do probably have just as good a capacity though.

Also, have you done cycle life testing to see if any seem to hold up over higher numbers of cycles than others before capacity starts to drop?

longus catus · Dec 6, 2012

jasaero said:
In all your testing does there seem to be any correlation to apparent build quality and capacity? And do any of them offer a bit better grade cover in the huge ones than others? I have got some that had some very odd build quality aspects like the contacts being of some obviously cheap casting method and such. And had some that came with covers that just fell apart. I agree that these cheap ones do probably have just as good a capacity though.

Also, have you done cycle life testing to see if any seem to hold up over higher numbers of cycles than others before capacity starts to drop?

The only extended battery battery covers that are unique are the Mugen and Seidio ones. The feature that makes the Mugen one unique is very poorly made, however. The seido back cover is the only one worth talking about... You can purchase is sans battery here: SEIDIO | Smarter Mobile Accessories

Build quality is pretty much the same... The phone batteries have only come from 2 different manufacturers, and there's not much to a battery... you can see some pics of the inside of a battery if you google 'a look inside an extended battery'. But basically, it's a square plastic frame, 1 or 2 batteries glued if more than 1, a flat connector wire, and the little electronics/terminal PCB. Then they're covered in a wrapper. I haven't looked with the intent to find differences, but the Mugen battery inside looks just like the anker battery inside.

The contacts aren't made by casting. They're etched out of a PCB.

jasaero · Dec 6, 2012

longus catus said:
The only extended battery battery covers that are unique are the Mugen and Seidio ones. The feature that makes the Mugen one unique is very poorly made, however. The seido back cover is the only one worth talking about... You can purchase is sans battery here: SEIDIO | Smarter Mobile Accessories

Build quality is pretty much the same... The phone batteries have only come from 2 different manufacturers, and there's not much to a battery... you can see some pics of the inside of a battery if you google 'a look inside an extended battery'. But basically, it's a square plastic frame, 1 or 2 batteries glued if more than 1, a flat connector wire, and the little electronics/terminal PCB. Then they're covered in a wrapper. I haven't looked with the intent to find differences, but the Mugen battery inside looks just like the anker battery inside.

The contacts aren't made by casting. They're etched out of a PCB.

I guess I knew the doors weren't real unique configurationwise other than Seido and Mugen. I was just figuring maybe some used different quality plastics and such with same mold possibly. I know they vary in quality from device to device as my wifes generic droid charge battery cover was VERY crappy compared to my QCell GNex one. Didn't know if that was the device 100% or possibly slightly different supply chains getting used for the cover also?

When you say the "batteries" I am guessing you mean the 1 or 2 cells and that many "batteries" are assembled by well over 2 OEMs right? And the cast contacts I am referring to really did seem cast rather than etched on a pcb as is the norm. The were rough and had porosity. I understand that probably isn't common and never did take that one apart to see what the deal was.

longus catus · Dec 7, 2012

jasaero said:
I guess I knew the doors weren't real unique configurationwise other than Seido and Mugen. I was just figuring maybe some used different quality plastics and such with same mold possibly. I know they vary in quality from device to device as my wifes generic droid charge battery cover was VERY crappy compared to my QCell GNex one. Didn't know if that was the device 100% or possibly slightly different supply chains getting used for the cover also?

When you say the "batteries" I am guessing you mean the 1 or 2 cells and that many "batteries" are assembled by well over 2 OEMs right? And the cast contacts I am referring to really did seem cast rather than etched on a pcb as is the norm. The were rough and had porosity. I understand that probably isn't common and never did take that one apart to see what the deal was.

Yeah, the covers do vary, slightly. The onite one is slightly thicker than the hyperion/anker one... Hyperion/QCell use the exact same battery cover, and Anker/Gorilla Gadgets/somethingelseicantremember do too.

I've seen only two brand marks for all the batteries I've opened... around two dozen. I think once the cells are manufactured, they then all go to the same Chinese company that assembles them, and they offer branders pulldowns on a web page to select what they want... they choose the cell part number, the count, whether or not to have shims, and then they can choose the wrapper type then upload an image which gets printed to the wrapper. I find it amusing to imagine that these people can choose how much to screw their customers through a battery order configuration web page.

If you still have that weird battery, I'd like a pic. Never seen or heard of something like that before.

jasaero · Dec 12, 2012

longus catus said:
Yeah, the covers do vary, slightly. The onite one is slightly thicker than the hyperion/anker one... Hyperion/QCell use the exact same battery cover, and Anker/Gorilla Gadgets/somethingelseicantremember do too.

I've seen only two brand marks for all the batteries I've opened... around two dozen. I think once the cells are manufactured, they then all go to the same Chinese company that assembles them, and they offer branders pulldowns on a web page to select what they want... they choose the cell part number, the count, whether or not to have shims, and then they can choose the wrapper type then upload an image which gets printed to the wrapper. I find it amusing to imagine that these people can choose how much to screw their customers through a battery order configuration web page.

If you still have that weird battery, I'd like a pic. Never seen or heard of something like that before.

Not sure I still have any of them?? I will look though. They were super super cheap shipped from China ones that were stock size for my OG Droid. Think I paid like $5 for two off ebay direct from china. One seemed DOA and they shipped a third for free no questions asked.

srad2drag · Dec 12, 2012

I got one of those batteries on the way. I'll plan on putting it through its paces once I receive it.

Veritas4420 · Dec 12, 2012

I have the 6200mAh Hyperion extended battery and its awesome. with heavy use it so far has lasted me 2 days. with light use(1-2hrs screen time) it lasted around 2 days 18 hours. I'm not keeping the extended battery on all the time but it will be awesome to have for long trips and times where a charger will not be easily available.

Mugen's 6400mAh Note 2 battery...

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