Why the price of Spectral Souls is completely fair

[dabomb224]

Considering that many great full games on the Iphone App Store are $9.99 or more, I think that the asking price for Spectral Souls is very fair. For those who are familiar with I-OS titles, you may recall that games like Sonic the Hedgehog 4 are regularly released at a $15 price tag. I honestly think that the only reason that many Android users find $15 to be too much is because until now, there really weren't any full-blooded games released for our platform.

Yes, I will acknowledge that there are many full I-OS games that are significantly less than $15 (Riven: The Sequal to Myst just came out priced at $6), but consider the simple fact that the Iphone App Store currently has MANY full-blooded games to choose from. As a result, there is a lot of high quality competition to force down the selling price of any large-scale game project. The Android Market, on the other hand, is only recently beginning to get larger scale games. As such, games like Spectral Souls represent an experimental foreay into a higher class of Android application. Based on this fact, the developer can and must: a) Charge more due to lack of similar market competitors; and b) Charge more to insulate themselves against potential losses, should the Android Market prove unreceptive to a more expensive, higher-class product.

This $15 price tag is rough, but it's a necessary step for us to start getting more big name titles on our platform. If the game is not for you, you are free to vote with your wallet and pass on the purchase. But please, don't go demonizing the developers as being "greedy" for wanting to protect their investment into an uncertain market.



P.S.- I actually did go and purchase this title, and as a fan of Tactical RPGs, I am very satisfied with my purchase. Running a game of this size and complexity on a Droid X, I can see that it truly was optimized for the Android platform. I experience no slow-down whatsoever; if anything, the game runs even smoother on my phone than on the videos of the PSP version that I watched.

 

[diestarbucks]

I'm not so high on myself that I think what I say is important. But I like the context of your thread so I thought I would re-post what I recently put in another Spectral Souls thread because I feel it pertains to yours and I agree with you.

I have to say at first I balked at the $15 dollar price of this game. I had read reviews of the PSP version and it didn't seem like a game worthy of that price. After thinking about it for awhile I decide to go ahead and give it a try. Are there better Strategy RPGs out there through cheaper emulators? Absolutely yes. But for what it brings to a phone, the graphics especially, the amount of depth to it, the fact that it is so much more modern and is original to my phone, it is worth the purchase. I'm thankful the developers took the time to port the game to Android and I hope it encourages other developers to bring as deep of a gaming experience to Android. I think the money is worth it for fans of the genre and I applaud the developers for their efforts and apologize for my early cynicism.

 

[dabomb224]

I'm not so high on myself that I think what I say is important. But I like the context of your thread so I thought I would re-post what I recently put in another Spectral Souls thread because I feel it pertains to yours and I agree with you.

I have to say at first I balked at the $15 dollar price of this game. I had read reviews of the PSP version and it didn't seem like a game worthy of that price. After thinking about it for awhile I decide to go ahead and give it a try. Are there better Strategy RPGs out there through cheaper emulators? Absolutely yes. But for what it brings to a phone, the graphics especially, the amount of depth to it, the fact that it is so much more modern and is original to my phone, it is worth the purchase. I'm thankful the developers took the time to port the game to Android and I hope it encourages other developers to bring as deep of a gaming experience to Android. I think the money is worth it for fans of the genre and I applaud the developers for their efforts and apologize for my early cynicism.

Thanks for your post. What really caught me my eye is when you referred to Spectral Souls as a "port". You are absolutely correct in your use of the term. Unlike many other Tactical RPGs currently out there, this one is the first to be developed and optimized specifically for our platform, and if one takes the time to look at how smooth it runs, it really shows.

Could I use Snesoid to play a mostly smooth version of Tactics Orge for the SNES? Sure, but graphically it would be far inferior.

Could I use PSX4Droid to play a graphically similar game like Final Fantasy Tactics? Sure, but a smooth, glitch-free experience would be highly unlikely.

That's why, as you said, what this game brings to Android is wholely original, and that's why I believe that it stands strong at it's current price.

 

[diestarbucks]

You elaborated on my post perfectly. I agree with you 100%.

 

[Varking]

It is an upgraded version of a port. The graphics are higher res as HyperDevbox has said, and the load time issues are fixed. It is a superior product in every way compared to its PSP version.

As a member of DroidGamers I sent them questions for an interview and it should be up in a day or so. They talk about what it is like to program for Android, how big their team is, and what they want to do in the future. I might be biased but I think it will be a decent read. There are some translation issues that they said I could fix but I left it alone since I wanted it to be original.

 

[lordofthereef]

While I agree, the problem here is that people who think this way are not the people who complain. I, personally, am of the opinion that the game will sell much better if the price is cut. There isn't any production increase on selling a larger volume of the game (they let google handle this all). Furthermore, you are going to be pretty hard pressed to see a game from an unknown developer launching at that price point. Sonic was mentioned. Sonic has also been a globally known IP for over twenty years. So has SEGA. Some other comapnies I see launching games at this price point are Square-Enix and Capcom. All of these are well known and respected. Spectral souls may be a fantastic game worth every penny and then some, but there is something to be said about perceived value. It is the main reason "brand name" items sell so well for so much more; they are an established brand and people know a little bit of what to expect. Lastly, on the iPhone, if you have a 3GS or better (models within the last ~2 years), you know the game is going to run just fine. There are current gen "high end" Android devices that run some of these games poorly. This can be a HUGE risk for someone, especially with the dysmal 15 minute return policy changes. For a larger game, that isn't even enough time to download and fully install the game and test it before your time is up.

 

[Varking]

For a larger game, that isn't even enough time to download and fully install the game and test it before your time is up.

While that would be true normally, that will not apply to Spectral Souls:

They posted this on another site but if your system can not handle the game, it will not let you start downloading the data. If you can install the game, it should be playable. I will see if I can find the link.

EDIT: Here it is: Spectral Souls is out on the Android Market now! - Page 2 - Android Forums

Here is the quote:

Our games are designed to take advantage of recent hardware, we have support for neon for example , there is no real reason to make a list on our game description because there is not list, if the game is not supported then you will get a hardware check message at the boot, so you'll have the time refund, then if the game proceed to the install, the game should run, if not, just hit a mail to our support explaining the issue and if confirmed , we shall refund you

and this:

The game has a hardware check, if the hardware is not supported, you can ask the refund right away within the 15 mn. If the game let you install the data then... you can play the game, the game runs even on a G1 google , not very good performances, granted but it works and is playable. If we discover one problem with a particular device, our policy is to refund right away, fix the issue and let the customer know about the new version

 

[lordofthereef]

While that would be true normally, that will not apply to Spectral Souls:

They posted this on another site but if your system can not handle the game, it will not let you start downloading the data. If you can install the game, it should be playable. I will see if I can find the link.

EDIT: Here it is: Spectral Souls is out on the Android Market now! - Page 2 - Android Forums

Here is the quote:



and this:

Please note, I wasn't necessarily SPECIFICALLY addressing this game, but also all unknown games from not-so-well-known developers. Also, since I don't know what the hardware check actually does, if it passes, is the game guaranteed to play completely smoothly? I would be less worried about the game not running as I would about choppiness.

the game runs even on a G1 google , not very good performances, granted but it works and is playable

This alone would seem to imply that it is not the case... who wants to drop $15 on a game that potentially has bad performance? The enthusiast might (but then again the enthusiast might have the system to support the game), but NOT the average consumer.

 

[Varking]

Should run perfectly on your Evo. The only choppiness anybody has reported so far is that every now and again, like 20-25 minutes in, the ability or casting animations get choppy on my OG Droid for about four seconds. After that it is fine. So, if you have a device stronger than a Droid, you should be good.

 

[lordofthereef]

Should run perfectly on your Evo. The only choppiness anybody has reported so far is that every now and again, like 20-25 minutes in, the ability or casting animations get choppy on my OG Droid for about four seconds. After that it is fine. So, if you have a device stronger than a Droid, you should be good.

Again, perhaps I wasn't clear, but I was speaking less for myself and more from a general consumer mindset. Frankly, I am not terribly interested in the game, but was speaking for those that might be. If it were a couple bucks, I might pick it up to give it a try, which was my other point. Games under $5 sell so well because of the "it's just a couple bucks" mindset. People don't mind trying something for a couple bucks. They do, when it's $15

 

[diestarbucks]

You'll have to forgive Varking. He means well, he just gets a little overprotective about this game.

 

[lordofthereef]

You'll have to forgive Varking. He means well, he just gets a little overprotective about this game.

There is nothing at all to forgive. He made great points (and I would like to think I did too). I think a $15 price point for a relatively unknown game that plays on a phone is a little scary to the average buyer, is all. Throw it onto xbox live or playstation store and I am sure people will eat it up!

 

[shaolin95]

Again, perhaps I wasn't clear, but I was speaking less for myself and more from a general consumer mindset. Frankly, I am not terribly interested in the game, but was speaking for those that might be. If it were a couple bucks, I might pick it up to give it a try, which was my other point. Games under $5 sell so well because of the "it's just a couple bucks" mindset. People don't mind trying something for a couple bucks. They do, when it's $15

I agree...at a few bucks ($5) buying is a no brainer...at $15 I am sure people will look at warez sites first instead of just paying the well deserved money....is not nice but it is the reality we live.

 

[azrhei]

Was it really necessary to make yet a third thread about why this game is "so much teh awesome!11" and how it is appropriately priced, as if in the first two threads your (collectively speaking to everyone in this thread) arguments in support of your opinions that it is appropriately priced were somehow diminished by the clamor of people refusing to buy anything priced at $15?

Just on principal and in the interest of scientific study to see if this spawns a fourth thread:

Spectral Souls (great graphics and sound, polished gameplay, high production values) sales: 500 - 1000 units (market listing as of 1/23/11) @ $14.53 per = MAXIMUM potential $14,530

Robo Defense (Its cheap, easy to play, thats about it) sales: >250,000 units (market listing as of 1/23/11) @ $2.99 per = MINIMUM $747,500

The market speaks for itself, I rest my case. Don't let that stop you from making another thread though.

Edit to add: I lose more than $2.99 in my washing machine. I wouldn't think twice about buying a game under $5 if there was even a semi-halfway-maybe-kinda chance it could be fun for 10 minutes. $5 is the kind of money you throw away on a 1oz box of candy at a movie theatre that will last you 15 seconds. It is an inconsequential, absolutely disposable amount of money, regardless of your economic condition. The same can not be said of breaking a Jackson, at all tiers of economic condition.

 

[JiMMaR]

actually , adding a lite version would solve this whole issue of not sure if the game runs or not .. am planning to get the game in the future (now I wanna finish the ones I bought and never played .. yeah .. am a sucker for sales >_>)

having a lite version that even includes just one battle (as a performance test or something) would clear all doubts

 

[azrhei]

economic advice from those who don't understand economics 101.

Not sure if that was directed at my post, but if it was: Law of Demand.

 

[Varking]

Robo Defense (Its cheap, easy to play, thats about it) sales: >250,000 units (market listing as of 1/23/11) @ $2.99 per = MINIMUM $747,500

The market speaks for itself, I rest my case. Don't let that stop you from making another thread though.

250,000x 2.99 = 747,500 x 30% that Google Takes from all sales = 224,250 for Google. 523,250 for the developers.

On top of that you aren't factoring in the fact that Robo Defense, for a LONG time, was the ONLY decent game on the Market.

It is hard to compare a game that came out on January 15th or so, of 2011 to a game that came out around May 15th, 2009.

Had Spectral Souls come out almost two years ago you would see a much higher sales number, as well as once it climbed the charts in sales, even more people having faith in it and purchasing.

If they get a total of 10,000 sales at their current price, you can bet your bottom dollar that they will get more developers to port their quality games.

 

[batgeek]

i don't have access to my phone right now. could someone compare the numbers for Dungeon Defenders to Spectral Souls?

 

[Varking]

i don't have access to my phone right now. could someone compare the numbers for Dungeon Defenders to Spectral Souls?

Dungeon Defenders has 10,000-50,000 downloads at .99 to 2.99 a download. They had a 99 cent sale a couple of days ago. Dungeon Defenders is an online game though and obviously has more appeal. Most games that are "online" where you can play with/against other players do well on Android and iOS.

Parallel Kingdom is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.
Haypi Kingdom is a freemium game that has over 50k-250k downloads.
Pocket Legends is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.
Pocket Empires is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.

The lesson is people want games for free and would rather do in-app purchases than just pay for a game outright.

How will Dungeon Defenders sell on the Tegra Zone when it comes out? When the developers over at Trendy were asked if this was an accurate price on the Tegra Zone they responded with a "no comment" via email.

 

[azrhei]

Dungeon Defenders has 10,000-50,000 downloads at .99 to 2.99 a download. They had a 99 cent sale a couple of days ago. Dungeon Defenders is an online game though and obviously has more appeal. Most games that are "online" where you can play with/against other players do well on Android and iOS.

Parallel Kingdom is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.
Haypi Kingdom is a freemium game that has over 50k-250k downloads.
Pocket Legends is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.
Pocket Empires is a freemium game that has over 250k downloads.

The lesson is people want games for free and would rather do in-app purchases than just pay for a game outright.

How will Dungeon Defenders sell on the Tegra Zone when it comes out? When the developers over at Trendy were asked if this was an accurate price on the Tegra Zone they responded with a "no comment" via email.

Why don't you post the rest of the pictures, just for the sake of full disclosure.

Okay so from this we can gather that - with even Fruit Ninja having a 1000% mark-up over regular Android Market - the people compiling Tegra Zone are:

A. Insane

B. In it for "teh lulz"

C. Bat-shiat insane


I bought Dungeon Defenders on my Galaxy S for $2.99, AND on my wife's phone for another $2.99, and absolutely love it. It is without question a premium game. Hypothetically speaking if I were to upgrade to a Tegra device, and given the choice between the regular Android Market version of DD or the Tegra Zone version, I would pick the Android Market version. I personally do not feel that the addition of some glowy particle effects and spec lighting is enough to warrant an extra $12. If I want eye-bleeding-awesome graphics, I'll buy Dungeon Defenders for my PC (which we plan on doing). And while I fully understand that is just my own opinion, I'm willing to bet that many others will feel the same way. Obviously there is and always will be a market for the cutting-edge crowd, who will forever and without hesitation shell out any amount of money for anything so long as it is "the latest and greatest." But those people are not the mainstream. They are more like this guy,

if you don't understand what it means, it doesn't matter how many economic sounding terms you type.


Law of imperical economical supply is inversely related to unimperical command economy demand...... imperical



duh

That doesn't know how to spell empirical but tries to use it in a zany economics argument on the internet about a game that very few people are buying but a vocal minority wishes everyone was.

 

[Varking]

We also aren't taking into account how much it might cost them to get the license to port the game. At 5.99 after Google takes their cut Hyoerdevbox pays the owners of the IP, they may be making just a few cents. I am sure they didn't just decide to throw 14 bucks as the price just for lulz.

 

[ahffkenep]

I guess developers, when they price it, would know that high price discourages people from buying it. It's their choice. Although i do personally think the game is well worth15 bucks, if they could sell 20 of $.99 game while they sell one with $15 price tag, why not?lol

 

[dabomb224]

Was it really necessary to make yet a third thread about why this game is "so much teh awesome!11" and how it is appropriately priced, as if in the first two threads your (collectively speaking to everyone in this thread) arguments in support of your opinions that it is appropriately priced were somehow diminished by the clamor of people refusing to buy anything priced at $15?

Just on principal and in the interest of scientific study to see if this spawns a fourth thread:

Spectral Souls (great graphics and sound, polished gameplay, high production values) sales: 500 - 1000 units (market listing as of 1/23/11) @ $14.53 per = MAXIMUM potential $14,530

Robo Defense (Its cheap, easy to play, thats about it) sales: >250,000 units (market listing as of 1/23/11) @ $2.99 per = MINIMUM $747,500


The market speaks for itself, I rest my case. Don't let that stop you from making another thread though.

Edit to add: I lose more than $2.99 in my washing machine. I wouldn't think twice about buying a game under $5 if there was even a semi-halfway-maybe-kinda chance it could be fun for 10 minutes. $5 is the kind of money you throw away on a 1oz box of candy at a movie theatre that will last you 15 seconds. It is an inconsequential, absolutely disposable amount of money, regardless of your economic condition. The same can not be said of breaking a Jackson, at all tiers of economic condition.

1. There aren't currently 2 other threads about this. One was created by the developer way back, and the other was created to announce the game.
2. Its called a discussion forum because people discuss things here. Perhaps you were looking for the "People who go out of their way to make angry posts when things that don't interest them get discussed forum". That one's down the hall.

3. Your commentary on the "economics" of the development market fails to account for so many other factors that an Intro to Microeconomics undergrad student could tear it apart.

 

[xefe]

without a trial version of this, I highly doubt many will be dropping 15$ on it. regardless of android markets ability to refund purchase within 24 hours.

 

[bigbadwulff]

Seeing as though I have yet to buy one app....

I'm not much into the game scene and $15.00 sounds like a lot of $. But if the game is good and you enjoy it, $15.00 is not much considering it costs twice that every month just to use our phones as a media device on 'the network'.