Help HTC M8 Camera Discussion-Show off your pictures!

[CafeKampuchia]

I have not seen any photos posted yet from
S5 or Z2 as they both have not been released yet.
Could you post a link, as I am very curious.
Thx.

Look up a few posts.

 

[sean76]

I know, this guy seem to poo poo on the M8, but his photos seem gorgeous.

Gear Review: A Photographers Take on The HTC One M8 (2014) | Colby Brown Photography

Lol...those are some pretty good pics not for nothing. As I always say, sometimes its the photographer, and not always the camera. But 4MP out of perfect lighting conditions may not work for me, and many others who just need a pretty good shooter

 

[sean76]

It seems the masses either hate the camera or they don't... just my take. It's entirely what floats ones boat. If you desire a phone with a stellar camera and the M8 is below the mark for you, it's just not the phone for you. It's as simple as that. If it reaches the mark that's ok, then perhaps it should be considered. It's a choice all consumers will make.

And trust me, I understand how one might feel after waiting for the M8 only to find that it isn't what I wanted. It has to be a real let down. I would feel the same if the BT didn't work or something similar that's way important to me. Photos are not that important to me. I can't speak for others... it's their call. But for me the phone meets and exceeds my desires.

Don't get me wrong, I love the phone. But its like why do that? In a time when people really use their shooters, why really go that route? People were screaming last year, and now you do it again with even better hardware, and to boot put a 5MP shooter on the front? hahaha, that CEO needs to go.

Only thing I can think of is that they figured they were building the perfect phone but didn't want to make it so perfect that next year people won't go out and spend again, so skimp and then next year begin the growth of 8MP, or 10, etc. By that time so many phones will have exceeded those numbers. Just not a smart way for a company to think when they are in the red. Blackberry followed that trait, look at where they are now. Is what it is though.

 

[EarlyMon]

Some would say that composition is often more important than absolute detail.

I don't have a M8, but I do have an HTC - the attached is lifted from a video I took (so, 2 MP, not even 4) and played with until I got what I liked.

View attachment 69172

And I think that a lot of people are forgetting that the usual course of business for HTC since 2011 has been to release the phone and then do an update that addresses camera complaints.

I think that sucks myself. I also think it sucked when it happened with the Moto X, Nexus 4, and Nexus 5. See, I'm not saying that it's ok because others do it, I'm saying that it sucks.

The whole idea that HTC is compromising on the 4 MP shooter is true. And they've said repeatedly that they think that their target market is people posting to social media. Default max of 4 MP is better for that.

If that's not you and you're unhappy with the detail on your Android, try Camera360. A huge problem for most phones and with most reviewers (almost all of them, really) is JPEG compression. Reviewers prattle on about megapixels as if they know - and they're more often comparing compression than megapixels when complaining about details. You can get rid of most of it with the save option on some apps, and I've found that Camera360 doesn't suck a lot when it comes to that. Something to consider with any Android, see for yourself.

In any case, HTC compresses very aggressively and they always have. It results in smaller file sizes, again, their target for social media uploads using mobile data.

Personally, I hate it, I wish that they had JPEG compression control options, but I understand where they're coming from.

So as for the whole "HTC needs to get a clue" meme - they already have. And if it doesn't match your needs, I can dig the frustration. If it's too great, you need to choose another phone if it's one of your top needs or live with it if you can't. Obviously, once you kill the compression problem, you're still left with just so many MPs for enlarging and cropping.

And remember that a lot of people, probably some you know, take short videos now and then extract the frame that's best. And regardless of specified MPs, those shots are going to be 1 or 2 MP, depending on if taken from 720p or 1080p video.

As for color and white balance - I'm not surprised. Some of that may be from the compression algorithm. Some of it may be corrected on an upcoming update.

Most all of that can be addressed by the built-in photo editor (that they keep changing, so maybe the M8 has it, maybe not) but definitely with any number of editing apps.

Hope this helps.

Edit/PS - I said HTC compromised on going with 4 MP. But the others with 8 and 13 or whatever MP compromised by making those little pixels - not Ultrapixels. Think about it - everything is a compromise.

 

[EarlyMon]

We're working on the forum software.

I apologize.

Here's the attachment I mentioned above.

 

[sean76]

Some would say that composition is often more important than absolute detail.

I don't have a M8, but I do have an HTC - the attached is lifted from a video I took (so, 2 MP, not even 4) and played with until I got what I liked.

View attachment 69172

And I think that a lot of people are forgetting that the usual course of business for HTC since 2011 has been to release the phone and then do an update that addresses camera complaints.

I think that sucks myself. I also think it sucked when it happened with the Moto X, Nexus 4, and Nexus 5. See, I'm not saying that it's ok because others do it, I'm saying that it sucks.

The whole idea that HTC is compromising on the 4 MP shooter is true. And they've said repeatedly that they think that their target market is people posting to social media. Default max of 4 MP is better for that.

If that's not you and you're unhappy with the detail on your Android, try Camera360. A huge problem for most phones and with most reviewers (almost all of them, really) is JPEG compression. Reviewers prattle on about megapixels as if they know - and they're more often comparing compression than megapixels when complaining about details. You can get rid of most of it with the save option on some apps, and I've found that Camera360 doesn't suck a lot when it comes to that. Something to consider with any Android, see for yourself.

In any case, HTC compresses very aggressively and they always have. It results in smaller file sizes, again, their target for social media uploads using mobile data.

Personally, I hate it, I wish that they had JPEG compression control options, but I understand where they're coming from.

So as for the whole "HTC needs to get a clue" meme - they already have. And if it doesn't match your needs, I can dig the frustration. If it's too great, you need to choose another phone if it's one of your top needs or live with it if you can't. Obviously, once you kill the compression problem, you're still left with just so many MPs for enlarging and cropping.

And remember that a lot of people, probably some you know, take short videos now and then extract the frame that's best. And regardless of specified MPs, those shots are going to be 1 or 2 MP, depending on if taken from 720p or 1080p video.

As for color and white balance - I'm not surprised. Some of that may be from the compression algorithm. Some of it may be corrected on an upcoming update.

Most all of that can be addressed by the built-in photo editor (that they keep changing, so maybe the M8 has it, maybe not) but definitely with any number of editing apps.

Hope this helps.

Edit/PS - I said HTC compromised on going with 4 MP. But the others with 8 and 13 or whatever MP compromised by making those little pixels - not Ultrapixels. Think about it - everything is a compromise.

Great points always Early...

 

[EarlyMon]

Great points always Early...

Thanks!

Yeah - reviewers don't really serve us. Ok, maybe they serve us a little bit. But they don't go back and show us how photos look after an update (and we know those are inevitable), and they talk as if what they show is fixed in stone as absolute facts. And when they do show photo update changes, do they go in depth or redo the comparisons to other phones? Not really. That doesn't sell web clicks. New controversy does.

And here's my problem with that - I don't like the HTC text app? I change it.

So, if I don't like my phone photos, what's the next logical step for me or any of us actual Android users who care?

Try another app.

It would be great if we didn't have to do that and the camera app were perfect.

And by the same token, I could say that about the browser. Or SMS. Or the launcher. Or... LOL

Anyway - that opinion is worth every penny you paid for it.

Now - when am I going to see some more M8 photos in this thread?

Pictures or it didn't happen!!!!!

Amateur-Shooting Tip of the Day:

PS - I intentionally blurred my grandson's photo - a lot.

Why?

Pop it up on your screen - that'll probably be about the size of the print I have in my living room (around 4ish by 5ish or something).

Now, get up from your PC and step back 5 feet. Now 10 feet. Or further. What happens?

It gets sharper.

If you haven't done it yet - stop here, give it a try. See for yourself, words are no substitute.

Now, go into wherever you have your nice family photos in your living room or den. The nice and sharp ones. Look up close, per usual. Step back 10 feet. Further. Did they gain or lose sharpness and impact as you moved back?

Now you see not only what I did there, but why. And at any distance, the emotion of his wonder at the zoo comes through razor sharp - even though the picture isn't. It's low rez all the way. Forget megapixels. That shot is only 300 kilopixels. About 100 dpi on a print.

There's your amateur-shot tip for the day.

 

[Slug]

Notice the colours in some of the HTC images look a little off compared to the other two

the HTC picture is very yellow (poor white balance) and lacks contrast compared to the S5 and Z2

Actually, it's not consistent across every sample image; the M8 images in the upper two sets look, viewed on a colour-balanced and calibrated monitor, to have the least colour cast. In the bottom images of the statue, the S5 image has a noticeable green cast while the Z2's leans towards the magenta.

Tbh I'd say all merely demonstrate the difficulty of obtaining correct white balance under mixed lighting conditions, but as those responsible for the tests didn't think to include a grey card or ColorChecker for reference there's no way to say for sure.

 

[EarlyMon]

Actually, it's not consistent across every sample image; the M8 images in the upper two sets look, viewed on a colour-balanced and calibrated monitor, to have the least colour cast. In the bottom images of the statue, the S5 image has a noticeable green cast while the Z2's leans towards the magenta.

Tbh I'd say all merely demonstrate the difficulty of obtaining correct white balance under mixed lighting conditions, but as those responsible for the tests didn't think to include a grey card or ColorChecker for reference there's no way to say for sure.

That a BIG twofer, right there.

One, as you say, is the fact that they didn't include a reference.

Two, as you say, the monitor. I'm using a gamma-calibrated monitor, right now. If you're not and you're really concerned about color prints, then your best bet is to probably download the images and print them to compare.

And then if unhappy, see how much color editing is needed and if you can live with that.

If you're undecided on the M8.

 

[Slug]

That a BIG twofer, right there.

Oh it gets better.... or worse.

One, as you say, is the fact that they didn't include a reference.

That's somewhat forgiveable, albeit it's standard practice when reviewing digital cameras to eliminate unforseen variables.

Two, as you say, the monitor. I'm using a gamma-calibrated monitor, right now. If you're not and you're really concerned about color prints, then your best bet is to probably download the images and print them to compare.

That presumes that (a) the images have the correct colour profile 'tagged', (b) that your viewing software correctly interprets the colour profile, and (c) the printer does likewise. It's a minefield out there.

That's why every image I put online is processed and tagged as sRGB - it's the lowest common denominator. It doesn't stop the occasional "gee, what's with the <insert colour here> cast?" comment, but at least I know that's down to the viewer rather than my workflow.

Interestingly, both the S5 and M8 "statue.jpg" images are tagged sRGB but no WB info is attached to the EXIF. As Firefox 28 is fully colour-managed, yet the images are markedly different, your guess is as good as mine as to which is the more accurate.

 

[EarlyMon]

You're absolutely correct again.

Well, I'm sure that others can chime in if they disagree, but at this point in the discussion, I'm reminded of a really old saying from back in my time -

What's it all mean, Mr. Natural?

In the spirit of the thread title, I'll answer with some samples.

How important is color anyway? Is color accuracy everything for your personal photos?

I'll let you all decide - I already know what Mr. Natural always said to the first question.

PS - if you go through these once, you can go through a second time right away to see the changes instantaneously if you want, avoiding the load times.

 

[C6ZR1]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a htc evo 4g lte and have been looking for an upgrade now.

For me I feel I've narrowed it down to SGS5 or the M8 and really leaning on the M8 because of its design/ UI but the only draw back for me is people saying the camera isnt that good.

The reason why the camera is the biggest concern for me is because I like going to car meets / go on cruises and like taking photos of cars at the meets / moving shots of the cars on free ways and scenic shots (sunsets / other nice views ).
These photos never go to print but rather stay on FB group pages/ instagram / on my computer

So I dont know if going to the M8 would be a downgrade with regards to picture quality or with my scenario it wont be an affect at all.

All suggestions/comments/opinions are greatly appreciated

 

[Tesla12]

The HTC One M8 camera is awesome/not awesome: you decide | Pocketnow

I think all camera phones act differently. The user is the winner for what is satisfactory for him or her.

 

[KOLIO]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a htc evo 4g lte and have been looking for an upgrade now.

For me I feel I've narrowed it down to SGS5 or the M8 and really leaning on the M8 because of its design/ UI but the only draw back for me is people saying the camera isnt that good.

The reason why the camera is the biggest concern for me is because I like going to car meets / go on cruises and like taking photos of cars at the meets / moving shots of the cars on free ways and scenic shots (sunsets / other nice views ).
These photos never go to print but rather stay on FB group pages/ instagram / on my computer

So I dont know if going to the M8 would be a downgrade with regards to picture quality or with my scenario it wont be an affect at all.

All suggestions/comments/opinions are greatly appreciated

WELCOME TO ANDROID FORUMS C6ZR1 ! arty:

I'm anything but a photo aficionado,but,general consensus is that this phone's camera is well-suited for what you'll be using it for on most occasions.

For a better idea of the pros & cons of the camera on the HTC ONE M8,look no further than here:

http://androidforums.com/htc-one-m8/837401-so-how-exactly-does-htc-duo-camera-work.html
http://androidforums.com/htc-one-m8/832012-htc-m8-camera-discussion-show-off-your-pictures.html

 

[sean76]

For what your using it for it should be fine. Especially outdoors and sunsets and all that. The shooter itself I found to be decent at best, and wouldn't hesitate to grab it if optical image stabilization was on board, however I use my video shooter alot on my nexus 5 and with OIS I get some pretty good looking videos, so it doesn't pay for me to downgrade. But the shooter itself looks a lot better then 4MP, and the bag of tricks that HTC provides with sense looks to be a ton of fun as far as playing around with filters and all that goes.

 

[jasonspeed]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a htc evo 4g lte and have been looking for an upgrade now.

For me I feel I've narrowed it down to SGS5 or the M8 and really leaning on the M8 because of its design/ UI but the only draw back for me is people saying the camera isnt that good.

The reason why the camera is the biggest concern for me is because I like going to car meets / go on cruises and like taking photos of cars at the meets / moving shots of the cars on free ways and scenic shots (sunsets / other nice views ).
These photos never go to print but rather stay on FB group pages/ instagram / on my computer

So I dont know if going to the M8 would be a downgrade with regards to picture quality or with my scenario it wont be an affect at all.

All suggestions/comments/opinions are greatly appreciated

I am coming from an EVO 4G which has an 8MP camera and I do the same thing, car meets and moving pictures. I don't think we will lose any image quality for FB shares or forum uploads but I think we will enjoy the speed of the snaps, especially for moving shots where you need to be quick. I spotted an Audi R8 on the road last fall (a rarity in my area) and the camera was able to get a shot but it was a bit too slow to get the shot I wanted. I wasn't able to capture the tell-tale side vents.

Oops, I forgot to mention the slow-mo video should be fun for track days if you don't already have a GoPro.

 

[CafeKampuchia]

Here is a perhaps more objective opinion coming from a professional photographer, without a grey card or ColorChecker of course! And he has worded it well:

Additionally, I found that the auto WB sometimes can be a touch off, such as during sunset/sunrise when there are a lot of magenta colors. This doesn

 

[EarlyMon]

Here is a perhaps more objective opinion...

This quote from the article linked above explains the psychology behind this issue in clear words:

If you're shooting for objectivity with clear words, then don't look at one paragraph out of context, by all means, continue the quote of the that article.

Yet I

 

[C6ZR1]

Thanks for the welcome KOLIO and everyone else's response

As far as car shots goes here are some pictures / lighting scenarios that I use my camera in, everything from bright sunlight to overcast mornings ( little more than "average car meets " ) .

Obviously not "professional" by any means but just like to have a decent picture lol

By the sounds of what everyone is saying looks like I'll be in reach of my M8 tomorrow really excited now

 

[SolApathy]

If you're shooting for objectivity with clear words, then don't look at one paragraph out of context, by all means, continue the quote of the that article.

Reads rather differently when you provide the rest of the statement.



...Well said, all too often opinions or statements are taken out of context with a little creative snipping.


I think the pictures he took with that camera were really stunning. You may not be able to make a poster out of the pictures due to pixellation and look at it up close, but for the masses this would be great. I would have no problem making a 10x14 out of one of those shots!

 

[EarlyMon]

And the fact that they find it's not as good as last year's model tells us what?

Last year's model came with a significant camera update shortly after release.

See what I did there?

Today I found I could shift my contract and maybe slide in to the M8.

And I really like a lot about the Note 3 and the LG.

 

[CafeKampuchia]

See what I did there?

Yes, you missed my point. I'll boil the first half of my previous post down to the basics of what I was trying to say:

This doesn

 

[Yatezy]

Gear Review: A Photographers Take on The HTC One M8 (2014) | Colby Brown Photography

Some great pictures taken in that review, judging by the lighting conditions pictures my S3 would completely struggle in aswell (not had a proper working HDR mode since i went AOSP).

I think im sold

 

[swerver32]

 

[CafeKampuchia]

Here are the results of the blind camera comparison phonearena.com ran over the weekend:

Nokia Lumia 1520 tops our blind camera comparison while Nexus 5 ends up last; HTC One (M8) finishes sixth

I always find it interesting to see what a couple thousand average Joes think in a blind, hence more objective, test. I hope they do this again after the S5 gets into their hands.