School shootings

[Unforgiven]

It is safe to assume that all guns are loaded and ready to fire until you personally unload the weapon or inspect it to prove it is not loaded.

In the army you are taught the first thing to do when handed a weapon is to open the breach and visually inspect that it is empty. It doesn't matter what you observed the person handing it to you do. Good habit to have.

 

[Hadron]

I just heard on the news that the gun is registered, but NOT to the girl's parents. She is not cooperating with police as to who the owner is or how she knows them. She has been charged with two counts, which I cannot recall right now.

If the gun is registered, surely that means that it's on record who the gun is registered to? I'm pretty sure that if something similar happened here the first thing the police would do would be to visit the registered holder of the weapon and ask some pretty pointed questions.

Mind you, that's a hypothetical: private possession of handguns was banned here following a school shooting 20 years ago, and even prior to that you were required to store them (and the ammunition) securely. So a kid getting hold of a gun would have been prima facie evidence that at the very least the holder had not been complying with the requirements of their license.

 

[Deleted User]

I would hope the local police visited the gun owner, and asked some very blunt questions.

 

[Unforgiven]

If the gun is registered, surely that means that it's on record who the gun is registered to? I'm pretty sure that if something similar happened here the first thing the police would do would be to visit the registered holder of the weapon and ask some pretty pointed questions.

Mind you, that's a hypothetical: private possession of handguns was banned here following a school shooting 20 years ago, and even prior to that you were required to store them (and the ammunition) securely. So a kid getting hold of a gun would have been prima facie evidence that at the very least the holder had not been complying with the requirements of their license.

I would hope the local police visited the gun owner, and asked some very blunt questions.

You pass a background check to purchase a gun, but they are not registered, for good reason.

 

[Member243850]

All our guns are registered here thats for sure you are not allowed to own one unless you get it registered.

This is a terrible story I can't believe it was an accident this I horrifying

A shooting or massacre and they are horrible indeed i was sick after watching some people getting hacked up with a panga / machete at school and some parents were screaming.

I felt weak an almost fainted. It was extremely scary w it wa hectic.

But still I have no idea who left a fire arm in the possession of very young child!

Totally irresponsible.

 

[Deleted User]

You pass a background check to purchase a gun, but they are not registered, for good reason.

Just interested, but is it not possible to trace a gun back to its original owner?
Suppose someone was shot, and the killer dumped the gun, which was subsequently found. The police have a bullet, and that can be matched to the gun. If they have a registered owner, that gives them a line of inquiry.

 

[dontpanicbobby]

That works on TV but unfortunately not all registrations are digital or sent to a central location.

 

[Hadron]

That works on TV but unfortunately not all registrations are digital or sent to a central location.

So what does "registration" mean if there isn't a register of ownership that's accessible to law enforcement?

I'm just trying to understand this. What does it mean for a weapon to be "registered" if the law enforcement agencies cannot identify the registered owner? Speaking as a European, so not intimately familiar with US laws here (which I know vary with state), I don't understand what the point of registration is if it cannot be used to link the weapon to the registered holder.

 

[dontpanicbobby]

The gun is "registered" where the law abiding owner lives. Considering there are more guns in the US than people If a registered gun is stolen it could turn up anywhere. A gun registered in a small town in Oregon could be stolen and end up involved in a crime Vermont. There is no central registry of firearm owners in the US.

 

[MoodyBlues]

The gun is "registered" where the law abiding owner lives. Considering there are more guns in the US than people If a registered gun is stolen it could turn up anywhere. A gun registered in a small town in Oregon could be stolen and end up involved in a crime Vermont. There is no central registry of firearm owners in the US.

Thanks for this. Hadron and I were wondering the same thing, and this explains it. Is it just me, or doesn't it seem like a national registry is in order?

 

[lunatic59]

The registration of firearms to individuals, just like automobiles, is under state jurisdiction. That's the way this country was setup.

However the Feds do issue licenses to gun dealers as part of the responsibilities of the ATF. On a national level it's easier to trace a gun back to who sold it than who bought it. Who uses it is an entirely different matter.

 

[MoodyBlues]

And now there's been another one, a devastating one, in Florida, yesterday. At least 17 dead, 19 injured, and a 19-year-old former student in custody.

 

[lunatic59]

Yes. The shooter was recently expelled for "behavioral problems". I think there was some kind of altercation involving a girl and another guy. Kids with access to weapons will always end in disaster.

 

[Member243850]

Oh my God this is so terrible

I feel so sorry for all families and all involved God bless you in such devastating and terrible times

Wow this is just horrifying

Why do these school shootings always follow one after the other?

Why do people think it is cool to kill someone!?!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copycat_crime

 

[MoodyBlues]

Oh my God this is so terrible

I feel so sorry for all families and all involved God bless you in such devastating and terrible times

Wow this is just horrifying

Why do these school shootings always follow one after the other?

Why do people think it is cool to kill someone!?!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copycat_crime

I don't know why they follow each other, but here's an absolutely unbelievable--but TRUE--statistic: Yesterday's shooting was the EIGHTEENTH so far this year (and we're only ~6 weeks into this year). Incredible.

 

[lunatic59]

The first thing they need to do is stop all the publicity. I think it's almost become suicide by media.

 

[MoodyBlues]

The first thing they need to do is stop all the publicity. I think it's almost become suicide by media.

The local channel whose news I watched earlier today is focusing on the victims and not repeating the shooter's name over and over again. I think that's a very good idea as these people thrive on publicity and attention, even though it's negative attention. Remember when John Lennon was killed? All I heard was "Mark David Chapman, Mark David Chapman...." Excuse me, but JOHN LENNON WAS KILLED. How about focusing on that?! (And he was killed on my birthday. )

 

[Deleted User]

The first thing they need to do is stop all the publicity. I think it's almost become suicide by media.

True but never going to happen. Media loves to sensationalise, and you can't get more dramatic than this

 

[Unforgiven]

Yesterday's shooting was the EIGHTEENTH so far this year (and we're only ~6 weeks into this year). Incredible.

I hate when a statistic like this is used. How many of them were suicides? How many were targeted gang murders? How many were accidental discharges? This argument cheapens and waters down the conversation and attention a serious, mass murder at a school deserves. It's like all these "comfort" animals masquerading as trained, certifies service animals. People that buy a vest on amazon so they can take their precious Fifi everywhere make it more difficult for the folks (and their service animals) that really need each other. Suicide is going to happen. Murder is going to happen. Don't water down the mass shootings at schools with barely relevant statistics so we can deal with the problem and not sensationalize it.

@MoodyBlues, that rant isn't directed at you, but the folks that publish it for headlines and the news media that run with it without giving it any critical thought.

 

[MoodyBlues]

I hate when a statistic like this is used. How many of them were suicides? How many were targeted gang murders? How many were accidental discharges? This argument cheapens and waters down the conversation and attention a serious, mass murder at a school deserves. It's like all these "comfort" animals masquerading as trained, certifies service animals. People that buy a vest on amazon so they can take their precious Fifi everywhere make it more difficult for the folks (and their service animals) that really need each other. Suicide is going to happen. Murder is going to happen. Don't water down the mass shootings at schools with barely relevant statistics so we can deal with the problem and not sensationalize it.

You're making an excellent point. We don't know how many of the 18 school shootings were accidents, except for the one this thread was originally about. It makes you wonder, doesn't it? I'd love to hear an actual breakdown of the types of shootings included in that number of 18.

@MoodyBlues, that rant isn't directed at you, but the folks that publish it for headlines and the news media that run with it without giving it any critical thought.

Oh, silly, *I* know that!

 

[psionandy]

I hate when a statistic like this is used. How many of them were suicides? How many were targeted gang murders? How many were accidental discharges?

How many of them involved Guns...... how many of them didn't?

 

[Unforgiven]

How many of them involved Guns...... how many of them didn't?

Not to be captain obvious, but I'm pretty sure that all school shootings involved guns. But your response begs the question, how many killings at schools are by other means? Stabbings, deaths as a result of fights, etc.

Anyway, I'm not saying there isn't a gun problem, but the urge towards mass killing seems like the larger issue. It's been done with knives, trucks, bombs, and yes, guns. There have been guns in America for hundreds of years, yet these mass killings are a relatively new thing, with a media sensationalized nexus at Columbine. I'm sure there are instances that predate that, but that's the first I remember the media going nuts over.

 

[mikedt]

How many of them involved Guns...... how many of them didn't?

How many school killings involved students with things like knives, swords, shuriken, nunchaku, etc. as apposed to guns?

 

[psionandy]

Not to be captain obvious, but I'm pretty sure that all school shootings involved guns. .

Not to be lieutenant obvious.... but if people want to solve the problem of shootings......

 

[PitCarver]

... There have been guns in America for hundreds of years, yet these mass killings are a relatively new thing, .../QUOTE]