Is Google Play Services a problem or isn't it?

[HealingHands33]

I'm running a Galaxy S2 with JB 4.1.2, not rooted, and have for a long time been pestered by Google to update Google Play Services, but have resisted because many of the reviews of GPS say that it's bloated, drains batteries, eats kittens, and does all manner of evil things to Android phones. The 3.7 star rating for the app on Google Play seems to reflect a fairly high level of dissatisfaction with GPS, so it's not just one or two whining users who are saying these things.

I'd appreciate learning from the savvy folks on this forum whether GPS is in fact the evil pig of an app that some upset users report, or whether in fact it is a good app, or perhaps a once-evil app which has been appropriately patched and is now worthwhile. I'm running into a couple of apps (e.g., my bank's app) which won't run without GPS, so I'm trying to decide whether to take the plunge and install the latest GPS version.

Many thanks in advance for any and all help.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[John Bean]

If you actually use the Google ecosystem then Google Play Services is an essential element - incidentally "GPS" is a really bad acronym to use for it for obvious reasons.

I rarely find it useful to stay with out of date software either, it's almost always better to keep "system" software up to date for all sorts of reasons. I've had issues with some versions of Play Services that have been fixed (as expected) in later updates and the current version seems pretty stable and trouble free to me.

So for me the choice is simple: use Google and keep the apps up to date or don't use it at all

 

[HealingHands33]

If you actually use the Google ecosystem then Google Play Services is an essential element - incidentally "GPS" is a really bad acronym to use for it for obvious reasons.

I rarely find it useful to stay with out of date software either, it's almost always better to keep "system" software up to date for all sorts of reasons. I've had issues with some versions of Play Services that have been fixed (as expected) in later updates and the current version seems pretty stable and trouble free to me.

So for me the choice is simple: use Google and keep the apps up to date or don't use it at all

Hi, John,

Thanks for your post. Yes, I realize that GPS isn't an ideal acronym for Google Play Services, but GooPs didn't sound good, and as for GooPlS, well...........

Under normal circumstances, I try to avoid anything Google-related, especially on my computers, but I didn't want an overpriced iPhone and the Windows OS for phones was a non-starter, so Android it is. If I had the know-how and courage to risk rooting my phone, I'd probably do it, primarily so that I could get rid of a lot of the unneeded Google bloatware, but for now I use a few pieces of the Google "ecosystem" out of necessity, but using them as little as possible, consistent with getting the results I need.

I guess my question boils down to this: Are most of the complaints about GooPS/GooPls (your choice!) now out of date because the current version has been updated to resolve the previous problems, or are there still reasons why potential users should be concerned about how the current app may behave on their phones?

Cheers,
HH33

 

[John Bean]

I can't answer that question (nor can anyone else) since there are bound to be people who will experience problems - and they're the loudest. You won't hear shouts of "Google Play Services works fine for me" from the silent majority of satisfied users (which includes me).

As for "bloatware" that's a purely subjective assessment, and one with which I strongly disagree in relation to Play Services. Not only is it not bloatware but is essential to the way I choose to use my phone and tablet. You're certainly not alone in choosing not to use Google's services but amongst Android users I would guess you're in a minority.

Android is all about choice; nobody forces you to do anything.

PS: I don't really understand the need to turn everything into an acronym just for the sake of it. I'm guessing it's just a cultural thing - American perhaps?

 

[chanchan05]

Google Play Services in theory is a good thing. It's the framework for Google apps, so they can send updates to the apps without the need for a new Android version. For example, Chrome won't work for Androids below 4.0. However, now if Google wants to change something in one of its apps under the hood, they don't need to tinker Android itself, just the Play Services.

In relation to this, if you don't use Google made apps like Chrome, Keep, Now, Drive, Gmail, etc, not updating Play Services won't matter. But if you do, you'd want to.

 

[HealingHands33]

I can't answer that question (nor can anyone else) since there are bound to be people who will experience problems - and they're the loudest. You won't hear shouts of "Google Play Services works fine for me" from the silent majority of satisfied users (which includes me).

As for "bloatware" that's a purely subjective assessment, and one with which I strongly disagree in relation to Play Services. Not only is it not bloatware but is essential to the way I choose to use my phone and tablet. You're certainly not alone in choosing not to use Google's services but amongst Android users I would guess you're in a minority.

Android is all about choice; nobody forces you to do anything.

PS: I don't really understand the need to turn everything into an acronym just for the sake of it. I'm guessing it's just a cultural thing - American perhaps?

Hi, John,

Thanks for your post. Some thoughts, in no particular order:

Acronyms are merely a convenience to save having to type long names over and over again in a document. Those who prefer to type out the full names repeatedly (may I perhaps suggest UNESCO for a start?) are of course free to do so. As to its being an American thing, the long lists of acronyms at the excellent Abbreviations and acronyms dictionary site make it clear that their use appears to be universally spread around the globe.

Actually, we do hear shouts of "Google Play Services works fine for me" in the great number of users who gave the app five stars. My concern was with the unusually high number of users who were giving low ratings and reporting problems. Of course there will always be some users who can't figure out or work with even the simplest apps and will take out their frustration by giving low ratings, but when well-regarded apps are getting ratings in the 4.2-4.7 range and this one, from Google itself, is getting only 3.7, it is not unreasonable to investigate why so many users are dissatisfied.

As to "Android is all about choice; nobody forces you to do anything," I must respectfully disagree and say that that is demonstrably false. If "Android is all about choice," why doesn't Android give users the choice of deleting non-essential or unwanted Google apps from the phone? Why doesn't Android give users the ability to use Google apps without having their privacy invaded by having their locations tracked, their emails scanned, and their Web choices recorded? If Android were really about choice, users would not be locked into using Google-supplied versions of Android software and there would be no need to root Android phones in order to be able to get choice.

Google does indeed offer many excellent applications, but they come at the price of invasion of the user's privacy, a price which I and many others - most of us, I suspect, with a knowledge of history and at least a little grey hair - find far too high and very disturbing, so we use Google apps sparingly when necessary, while choosing less invasive alternate applications when possible. As to those who like and prefer to use Google apps, I genuinely wish them well, as I am personally very much "all about choice."

Cheers,

HH33

 

[HealingHands33]

Google Play Services in theory is a good thing. It's the framework for Google apps, so they can send updates to the apps without the need for a new Android version. For example, Chrome won't work for Androids below 4.0. However, now if Google wants to change something in one of its apps under the hood, they don't need to tinker Android itself, just the Play Services.

In relation to this, if you don't use Google made apps like Chrome, Keep, Now, Drive, Gmail, etc, not updating Play Services won't matter. But if you do, you'd want to.

Hi, chanchan05,

Thanks for your informative post. I don't use any of the Google apps you mentioned, but when my bank's mobile app suddenly refused to work unless I updated Google Play Services (GPS), it suddenly became more than a "Google-related" matter for me.

Perhaps it would help if I were to restate my questions better:

A) Is GPS in fact unduly large, or is that merely the complaint of those with limited storage space on their phones?

B) Whether large or small, can it be moved to my external SD card, where I have loads of room, thus making its size (relatively) irrelevant?

C) Are the multiple reports of GPS causing rapid battery drain correct, and if so, has this problem been corrected in the latest version of GPS, or does it still exist?

D) Is GPS removable after installation, or is its installation an irreversible step?

Many thanks to any and all who can answer those questions.

Cheers,

HH33

 

[mikedt]

As to "Android is all about choice; nobody forces you to do anything," I must respectfully disagree and say that that is demonstrably false. If "Android is all about choice," why doesn't Android give users the choice of deleting non-essential or unwanted Google apps from the phone?

Android phones come with Google apps? Not around these parts they don't. In fact if I wish to use Google apps, I've got to go out of my way to install them myself, my choice. :thumbup:

 

[HealingHands33]

Android phones come with Google apps? Not around these parts they don't. In fact if I wish to use Google apps, I've got to go out of my way to install them myself, my choice. :thumbup:

I guess that's one downside (or is that an upside?) to living in China! As for me, I have all kinds of unwanted Google apps (Google Talkback, Google Search, Google Text-to-Speech, Hangouts, etc.) I'll be glad to give you if you can find a way to get them off my phone.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[nickdalzell]

There are many budget phones that seem stuck in a very stock Android 4.0 that have neither Play Store or Play Services. Extremely laggy, unsatisfactory experience. But to 'de-Google' a phone, just go to settings, apps, all, then select Google Play Store and Google Play Services and click the 'disable' button sitting next to Force Stop. They won't bug you anymore. Highly recommend Amazon Apps as an alternative app store. Also uncheck 'show notifications' for any apps you never use and they will cease filling your status bar with a gazillion redundant icons. I don't know about the rest of you but I have always hated that about Android, and a clean status bar with only the vital stuff present (signal, battery, Wi-Fi status) and badge numbers on each app is still the one thing I miss from iOS.

 

[mikedt]

I guess that's one downside (or is that an upside?) to living in China!

We often get a FAQ, often along the lines of "Help!! I bought this phone from Ebay or Ali Express, comes from China, and there's no Google Play on it!" ...and they often come with a load of Chinese stuff instead(bloat).

As for me, I have all kinds of unwanted Google apps (Google Talkback, Google Search, Google Text-to-Speech, Hangouts, etc.) I'll be glad to give you if you can find a way to get them off my phone.

Cheers,
HH33

I have a Samsung phone that wasn't purchased in mainland China, came with all the Google stuff. And in fact I did have problems with the Google stuff I don't use, doing it's own thing and my consuming limited metered cellular data, like G+, Hangouts and background data for Play.

Think have two choices really with the way that things are currently are:

1) Disable what you don't use, in app settings, in that way you never have to see them again and they're not active.

2) Root and remove them completely. :thumbup:

 

[HealingHands33]

But to 'de-Google' a phone, just go to settings, apps, all, then select Google Play Store and Google Play Services and click the 'disable' button sitting next to Force Stop. They won't bug you anymore. Highly recommend Amazon Apps as an alternative app store.

Well, I've disabled a few Google (and Samsung!) apps in the past and that has certainly helped, but if the latest version of my bank's mobile app is demanding the latest version of Google Play Services in order to function, I'm not sure how switching to Amazon Apps will solve that problem. Hmmm....

Cheers,
HH33

 

[HealingHands33]

1) Disable what you don't use, in app settings, in that way you never have to see them again and they're not active.

2) Root and remove them completely.

As noted in my previous post, I've disabled a few, but if I disable Google Play Services I may not be able to use my bank's mobile app, and perhaps others. Not sure how to get around that.

With regard to rooting, I'd love to be able to get it rooted so I could regain my freedom of choice as to what apps I do or don't want on my phone, but I can't risk bricking it. I'm reasonably savvy with Windows tech issues, but what I know about Android or Linux tech issues is essentially zero, so unless I can find a local "rooting pro" to do the job for me safely, I'll regretfully have to keep going as I am.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[nickdalzell]

Since when do bank apps require Google Play? Did you by chance download it from the Play Store? That might be it. Try using their website.

 

[HealingHands33]

Since when do bank apps require Google Play? Did you by chance download it from the Play Store? That might be it. Try using their website.

I appreciate the thought, but when I go to the bank's site, all they offer is the choice of clicking on links for Apple's App Store, Google Play, or Windows Phone store. I'm awaiting a call back from their tech services department to see if there's a way around this.

I'll post again on this when I get an answer.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[mikedt]

I appreciate the thought, but when I go to the bank's site, all they offer is the choice of clicking on links for Apple's App Store, Google Play, or Windows Phone store.

Because that's the easiest option for them. Then they don't have to distribute the APK themselves, and instruct everyone in how to enable loading of third party sources, sideloading.

 

[breadnatty08]

Have you tried viewing their desktop version of the website so it doesn't think you're on a mobile?

 

[Hadron]

I use very few Google apps myself, and being rooted have uninstalled those I am confident I'll never use. But as I use the Play Store I do use Play Services.

There have been times when it's been a battery hog, e.g. last year there was a bug which meant it could use a lot of power if you had location enabled (though a reboot often fixed that). At the moment I'm not aware of anything like that. It's important to remember that the web is full of reports of problems which were fixed long ago (for all sorts of things, not just play services), and sometimes people who once had or read about a problem will repeat it as if it were still current.

As for Google not allowing you to uninstall their apps (without root), that's not a specific protection of Google apps. The unrooted user can't uninstall any system apps. The reason for protecting system apps is simple: if you let the user uninstall anything they wanted, many people would remove stuff which they didn't think they needed but which turned out to be vital, which would then result in a lot of work for manufacturers and carriers fixing phones which ignorant users had broken (and of course they'd blame the manufacturer or Android, rather than themselves!). You could of course ask that only things which are really essential are installed as system apps, but then if the user has a problem and factory resets the phone they'd lose everything that isn't a system app whether they wanted to or not, so you lose that way as well. So while it's irritating, I can see why it's the least trouble to do it this way.

Note: that doesn't mean that I accept that carriers should be able to put their sponsored bloatware on as system apps, but that's another story!

 

[HealingHands33]

Thanks, Hadron, for addressing one of my core questions from Post #7, the question regarding battery drain. From what you've said, I understand that there was indeed a battery drain issue, as some users complained about, but that it has been fixed and is currently not a problem, which is of course good news.

If you or any other Forum users can shed any light on my other questions - i.e., the size of the Google Play Services app, whether it can be moved to the external SD card, and whether the installation of the app is reversible or irreversible - I'd be most grateful.

Thanks again for your helpful post.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[zuben el genub]

I appreciate the thought, but when I go to the bank's site, all they offer is the choice of clicking on links for Apple's App Store, Google Play, or Windows Phone store. I'm awaiting a call back from their tech services department to see if there's a way around this.

I'll post again on this when I get an answer.

Cheers,
HH33

Mike is right. All those app stores are now in the same position that IE was years ago. You had to use Internet Exploder to access any banking page.

Banking finally allowed other browsers, but the banks had never heard of Opera.

Now I've had a rep ask, in all seriousness, "What is Linux?" Using Pale Moon on Kubuntu.

It's easiest to write for average use.

 

[Hadron]

Mike is right. All those app stores are now in the same position that IE was years ago. You had to use Internet Exploder to access any banking page.

I remember that - banks requiring IE6, about the least secure browser ever, in order to access their services! I stayed away from online banking for a very long time.

If you or any other Forum users can shed any light on my other questions - i.e., the size of the Google Play Services app, whether it can be moved to the external SD card, and whether the installation of the app is reversible or irreversible - I'd be most grateful.

The basic app is 25MB on my HTC One, while a much older version was 19MB on my old handset. But app data use space too (5MB on my old handset, 22MB on my current one). I would not expect it to be movable to external SD, as that has to be supported by the developer and external SD cards don't figure highly in Google's thinking. Plus it normally comes with the OS as a system app, in which case it would not be moveable by definition, so there's no reason for them to support moving. Even if it could be moved, only part of the app would move and none of the data (true with any app you move to external SD).

Reversible or irreversible is a tricky one. Do you currently have it at all (& just wondering about updating) or not? On my old handset, whose software predates Google Play Services, the system menus give me the option to "uninstall updates". On the current one not even that. Probably best to assume not, but if it's not built into your current ROM you may be able to.

The flip side is that if you want to do banking from your phone it sounds like you don't have much choice.

 

[John Bean]

The flip side is that if you want to do banking from your phone it sounds like you don't have much choice.

Indeed. And it isn't Android (or Google for that matter) that is restricting choice in this matter.

 

[nickdalzell]

My bank's website works perfectly fine in Dolphin browser, which renders all sites in desktop view, also available from 1Mobile Market. Don't need Google Play. I prefer Dolphin's full-immersive UI over Chrome and the stock browser myself

 

[HealingHands33]

Indeed. And it isn't Android (or Google for that matter) that is restricting choice in this matter.

Agreed. As I've noted in a previous post, I'm awaiting a return call from the bank's Tech Support department in the hope that they can A) explain why updating Google Play Services is a necessary prerequisite for their app, and B) offer a way to work around this silliness.

Cheers,
HH33

 

[HealingHands33]

The flip side is that if you want to do banking from your phone it sounds like you don't have much choice.

Thanks, Hadron, for your detailed answers to my questions. That's a big help.

Like you, I stayed away from online banking for a long time, but am now a big user of it on my PC. I'm less comfortable with it on my phone, laptop, or any other mobile device, given the increased risk of theft, but it's handy for emergencies. My concerns about Google Play Services weren't sparked only by my bank app requiring it - I'd had those concerns since I was first asked to update Google Play Services and found the surprisingly low ratings and multiple reports of problems - but the bank app's refusal to open without updating a Google app was the trigger that sparked my investigation.

Thanks again to you and all the contributors who've posted here. I really appreciate the input.

Cheers,
HH33