Root No Bionic for me... and YOU?

[The_Chief]

Well, Moto has pretty much confirmed my worst suspicion: Bionic WILL have an encrypted bootloader.

Motorola employee confirms locked bootloaders -- and bad attitude | Android Central

You guys go right ahead and jump on it... my trusty Droid and I will keep on rockin' until a decent unencrypted phone comes along.

 

[androidlover14]

Im with ya chief. Htc Thunderbolt all the way.

 

[publicanimal]

As long as I can root it somehow I think I could live with the locked bootloader on the Bionic. The phone is almost too good to deny, though I agree lack of options to run custom software is a big downside.

At the same time I think that given the far advanced and "next generation" hardware the Bionic it will lend itself well to whatever future official Android iterations Google has in the pipeline, which I would imagine are going to get better and better with time.

 

[thaDroidz]

What does the bootloader actually do, and why is it bad that it's locked?

this doesn't make it non rootable does it?

I ask cause the Bionic may be the phone to make me upgrade from the D1..

 

[publicanimal]

As far as I understand the locked bootloader prevents you from running custom ROMs and/or kernels, but the phones are still rootable. At least this was the case for both the Droid 2 and the Droid X. So you are stuck with whatever software version of Android the carrier wants to send you, but you can still get Superuser access and even do some basic theming (colors/fonts).

 

[digdug1]

Here's hoping though:


Motorola Clarifies Stance on Bootloaders, Looks to Partner With Developers? - Droid Life: A Droid Community Blog

 

[digdug1]

As far as I understand the locked bootloader prevents you from running custom ROMs and/or kernels, but the phones are still rootable. At least this was the case for both the Droid 2 and the Droid X. So you are stuck with whatever software version of Android the carrier wants to send you, but you can still get Superuser access and even do some basic theming (colors/fonts).

Not true about the d2 and the x. There are many custom roms available now including some aosp. The kernal is adjustable but not interchangible.

 

[twistedlim]

You just can't get rid of the motoblur I believe.

Good attitute "buy someplace else"...I will.

I was at the verizon store yesterday playing around with the Dinc and the X. Loaded launcher pro on for a comparison to the droid. The X is still stuttering through the screens but the dinc was as smooth as my rooted droid. I think I will be looking at HTC and consider rooting if I think I need it. Right now I don't know I would even root the dinc if I had it and I am spoiled by how smooth and responsive my Droid is so moving to the X would be tough.

 

[swagner53]

Playing with the phones that are on display in the store is hardly a fair comparison as you have no idea what has actually been done to them. That aside---

A locked bootloader means it is more difficult but not impossible to change the ROM. There are ROMS available for the X and the D2 and both have locked bootloaders. It takes longer for developers to crack the bootloader, but they do it. It also makes installing ROMS just a bit more tricky, but not by much.

Rooting is another issue and the bootloader does not affect this.

Don't get me wrong here- I am annoyed as hell that Motorola insists on doing this. At most though- it delays my decision to buy a Motorola device until one of our ingenious developers cracks it. It does make the Thunderbolt a more attractive device for those that like to tinker until that happens.

 

[twistedlim]

Playing with the phones that are on display in the store is hardly a fair comparison as you have no idea what has actually been done to them. That aside---
QUOTE]

Agreed, just trying to get and idea. Both the dinc and X probably had been messed with a lot. But, that said my wife's incredible has functioned flawless and is pretty much as quick as my droid running at 1100. No stutters. I have yet to pick up a droid x that has functioned smooth but maybe it is me. Anyway, provided the data prices don't change I will probably go via the thunderbolt. If they charge any more for such limited 4g access they can keep it. Heck in Michigan you can only get 4g in the metro detroid area, no lansing, grand rapids, jackson, etc. When I am in the Detroit area I can usually hook up to wifi anyway. What I need it for is when I am out of the Metro areas.

 

[Papadroid]

Locked bootloader = waiting for manufacturers for updates = fail

Once Motorola stops updating the device your stuck if it still has a locked bootloader.

 

[shadowdude777]

Here's hoping though:


Motorola Clarifies Stance on Bootloaders, Looks to Partner With Developers? - Droid Life: A Droid Community Blog

It's probably a way for them to apologize for having an asshole response initially.

I've always said I'll never buy another Moto device. This holds up my previous statement.

 

[gwlaw99]

Even with the ability to root and add some custom roms on the X, has anyone been able to install roms with versions of android that are not yet available for the X?

 

[publicanimal]

Don't get me wrong here- I am annoyed as hell that Motorola insists on doing this. At most though- it delays my decision to buy a Motorola device until one of our ingenious developers cracks it. It does make the Thunderbolt a more attractive device for those that like to tinker until that happens.

The Thunderbolt does look very nice. My girlfriend has the HTC Evo for Sprint and it's great (she won't let me root it though ), and the Thunderbolt is essentially just the Verizon version of the Evo with a fatter kickstand.

I'm sure it's an awesome phone, it's just the fact that the Bionic has DOUBLE the processing power that makes me look forward to that particular phone. I won't be due for my final NE2 upgrade until July though, I think that's about when the Bionic is supposed to be released. So, I'll just have to see what else is available by that time. I think the Thunderbolt is due out in a month or so. It should be the best Verizon phone for the early part of this year.

If my contract was up and I was to be buying a phone in the near future it would be be between the HTC Thunderbolt for Verizon or the Samsung Nexus S for T-Mobile. I'd probably go with the Nexus S. I still don't know what Verizon 4G pricing will be like, but I doubt I could afford it and spend most of my time on WiFi anyhow.

 

[gallandof]

as much as im looking forward to the bionic im dreading the locked bootloader. my D1 has spoiled me with its support id hate to go to a phone that has a fraction of the dev after market customization.

 

[digdug1]

Even with the ability to root and add some custom roms on the X, has anyone been able to install roms with versions of android that are not yet available for the X?

yes team black hat has done this via update.zip, and a full sbf. they arent the only ones either.

there have been major advances in with the bootloader issue. for those wondering check out the all things root section for the x. the only thing the locked bootloader prevents currently is changing the kernal.

 

[digdug1]

Locked bootloader = waiting for manufacturers for updates = fail

Once Motorola stops updating the device your stuck if it still has a locked bootloader.

should have multi-quoted my last post but the above quote is incorrect. you are not stuck. devs have created viable workarounds. i ran .340 long before it was released.

 

[xmr405o]

I just want a dual core phone with an unlocked bootloader. That's it! Until then, I'm hanging on to my D1 until its Ddone. Get it! Ok bad joke.

 

[ghmerrill]

The one thing that I like about the moto phones is that the reception- both call quality and data- seems so much better than on the htc phones. To be fair, i'm comparing the d1 and dx, the only two moto android phones I have used, with the only two htc phones I have experience with- the eris and the incredible.
the moto phones get better call quality, faster data, and just seen more sturdy. Why can't someone build a high quality phone to compete?

 

[tmarr]

Where there is a will there is a way. Someone will break the encryption eventually... they always do!

 

[teddyearp]

The one thing that I like about the moto phones is that the reception- both call quality and data- seems so much better than on the htc phones. To be fair, i'm comparing the d1 and dx, the only two moto android phones I have used, with the only two htc phones I have experience with- the eris and the incredible.
the moto phones get better call quality, faster data, and just seen more sturdy. Why can't someone build a high quality phone to compete?

+1 ^^^ this. I am a batwings 4ever type of guy. I did even try a HTC phone, but found the build to be inferior to a Moto.

As you all know (or not from some of the posts in this thread) the 'locked' bootloader does not prevent root, nor the installation of a custom rom and/or themes. What it apparently does prevent is the full installation of a custom recovery image, which is why the D2 and DX are a bit more finicky when it comes to doing these things. Sure on the two aforementioned phones you do have CWRecovery, but the way it's installed doesn't give any REAL fallback like we have on the A855. The more complete and best info is here:

OPTICALDELUSION: Clearly you have no idea what an eFuse is.

That said, it seems as though the A855 phone was almost marketed to the hacking commmunity when Moto needed a big fat boost to get them out of the slump from the razr lines that took off so well at first but they subsequently kept locking down more and more as they went, killing sales.

So for me, I'll keep my A855 (I baby the crap out of it) and hope that the rest of you go to HTC phones so that Moto will wake up and build another 'development' phone for the masses. If I have to, I can always wait them out even further with my A4500 Napoleon.

 

[ocman]

Android is by no means optimized for the upcoming dual core processor that the Bionic has rendering the extra power pretty much useless.

 

[Papadroid]

should have multi-quoted my last post but the above quote is incorrect. you are not stuck. devs have created viable workarounds. i ran .340 long before it was released.

If they can't find a way to change out the kernel then one day they will be stuck. When going from 2.1 to 2.2 it required a change to the kernel. As it seems now 2.2 kernels will work on 2.3 but if beyond 2.3 requires kernel changes then it will be stuck. Now hopefully devs will have found a solution by then but until then I will not buy a phone with a locked bootloader.

 

[shadowdude777]

Where there is a will there is a way. Someone will break the encryption eventually... they always do!

The DX still has an encrypted bootloader. I don't want hacky workarounds, I want a legitimately unlocked bootloader.

 

[teddyearp]

If they can't find a way to change out the kernel then one day they will be stuck. When going from 2.1 to 2.2 it required a change to the kernel. As it seems now 2.2 kernels will work on 2.3 but if beyond 2.3 requires kernel changes then it will be stuck. Now hopefully devs will have found a solution by then but until then I will not buy a phone with a locked bootloader.

Exactly

The DX still has an encrypted bootloader. I don't want hacky workarounds, I want a legitimately unlocked bootloader.

Here, here.