It finally happened...

[Blrfl]

Go to verizon and demand a new incredible or something or say you are going to sue them and htc. What if someone was hurt, what if nobody else was around. That is a manufactured flaw that could hurt someones life.

Verizon will say, "go right ahead. Knock yourself out," because legally, their butt is covered. The contract every subscriber signs makes no guarantee that any level of service will be available at any time or place and the warranty on the handset disclaims fitness for any particular purpose.

Cableguy, demand to speak to a higher up immediatly tell them the problem, and if they say its an issue with just your phone take it to the law, by all laws, you are required to be able to reach 911 with out issues.

Let me clarify that a little for you: FCC rules require that mobile carriers connect 911 calls from any handset, subscribed or not, to a public safety answering point. If the handset is incapable of placing the call or there's no network for it to connect with, it's out of the carrier's hands.

--Mark

 

[Skyholder]

Verizon will say, "go right ahead. Knock yourself out," because legally, their butt is covered. The contract every subscriber signs makes no guarantee that any level of service will be available at any time or place and the warranty on the handset disclaims fitness for any particular purpose.



Let me clarify that a little for you: FCC rules require that mobile carriers connect 911 calls from any handset, subscribed or not, to a public safety answering point. If the handset is incapable of placing the call or there's no network for it to connect with, it's out of the carrier's hands.

--Mark

I still don't think Verizon, nor HTC, nor Droid would be eager to have the negative publicity.

 

[dilokiam]

I still don't think Verizon, nor HTC, nor Droid would be eager to have the negative publicity.

Let's hope so, I mean, they all need to protect their brands.
Look at the damage control Toyota has done with their new commercials.

 

[cableguynoe]

Here is a few of the concerns I have before doing some, if not all, of the suggestion you guys have posted.

First, I have this feeling that the Verizon rep/manager i talk to will not know or admit to the problem. What proof do I have?
If they tell me, which I'm sure they will, that my phone is the problem, what can I do?
I am on my original Eris... so would I not have to at least give this option a try before I can say "see, i told you it wasn't the phone"?

I now wish I had done a few swaps because of this problem already... then I would really have something. But my rooted eris is what got me to deal with this problem for this long.

My experience attempting to call 911 definately helps... but i just have a feeling it's not going to be quite enough.
It's fortunate that this girl didn't get hurt... or anyone else for that matter. But I feel this also works against the suggestions about taking to the media. Since I can't actually say that something bad happened because of this problem.
Only what could've happnened. And we've all been saying that for a while.
I just got really close this time.

 

[scary alien]

cableguynoe,

Bummer this happened to you and the girl in the accident...glad she's okay.

If you do want to pursue this, you sort-of have some "proof": your call history on your phone (and in VZW's database?). You could also get a copy of any police report, especially if you were listed as a witness.

This sort of in-hand stuff should certainly get their attention and at least hopefully prod a VZW manager to try to do something for you.

 

[gospodinwizard]

First of all yes not being able to call 911 truly sucks. I have called 911 from my Eris without an issue. I did notice one odd thing though. Right after I talked to 911, the phone went into some sort of emergency mode for I think it was 5 minutes. At that point all I could do was to make or receive calls from/to 911 for 5 minutes. After that everything went back to normal. Also, after I nixed Sense and started using Launcher Pro, silent calls/dialer lag have been non-existent. The only caveat is that if I have Google Voice installed on the phone there is occasionally a pause before the call connects whether or not the call actually goes through Google Voice.

Dealing with any remotely significant technical issue in a Verizon store is next to pointless imo. Most of the store reps I have run across seem at best slightly more competent than a trained monkey. To get anything actually accomplished at a store I have always had to talk to a supervisor at *611 and get them to tell the store what to do. Of course it helps that I have 5 lines on my account and usually tell them something like "I am sitting in the parking lot at the ATT store."

Yes, the ERIS has issues. HOWEVER, every phone I have ever had had its own issues. For example, my last and favorite until the ERIS was a LG Voyager which had the annoying habit of cutting off in the middle of calls.

Basically, you pay Verizon and thus have at least some right to expect satisfaction. Be firm and don't take no for an answer. That's how I got my ERIS shortly after it came out for $29 without using an upgrade/exchange/etc.

 

[Nabraham]

Dude that is such bullcrap. Go to verizon and demand a new incredible or something or say you are going to sue them and htc. What if someone was hurt, what if nobody else was around. That is a manufactured flaw that could hurt someones life.

LMAO, sue them for what? Because the phone had trouble dialing a number? HTC/Verizon didn't cause the injury to the girl. Unless its a widespread acknowledged problem i doubt a legal fight with them could go anywhere.

 

[Nabraham]

Let's hope so, I mean, they all need to protect their brands.
Look at the damage control Toyota has done with their new commercials.

Yes, because this incident is definitely on par to the issues Toyota had with their vehicles....

 

[Demache]

Yes, because this incident is definitely on par to the issues Toyota had with their vehicles....

I wouldn't call "not being able to reliably call 911" a small issue on a cell phone.

 

[Nabraham]

I wouldn't call "not being able to reliably call 911" a small issue on a cell phone.

How many people has it happened to? Don't you think if it was happening quite a bit the media would start to get a hold of it? One guy on a forum isn't what i call widespread.

 

[xx_bishop_xx]

I think they are designed to be able to place emergency calls without service for reasons such as these. I'm not certain how/if it is mandated; however.

 

[Demache]

How many people has it happened to? Don't you think if it was happening quite a bit the media would start to get a hold of it? One guy on a forum isn't what i call widespread.

May have happened to others that don't use this forum. I don't know. But the Eris not being able to reliably make calls is a widespread problem on the phone. Its not something should be taken with a passing glance and say its a minor issue. Especially since it IS a phone, bells and whistles aside. If its a software issue, then all they have to do is patch it. Hopefully that's what the update coming does.

 

[tonyb81]

Wasn't there a ROM that someone released, but had to take down because of this same exact issue. I'm only playing devils advocate here, but your phone is rooted, maybe that was the reason why?

 

[Demache]

Wasn't there a ROM that someone released, but had to take down because of this same exact issue. I'm only playing devils advocate here, but your phone is rooted, maybe that was the reason why?

Your partially right. A ROM was released with problems with 911. I don't think it would even dial the call. So its unrelated to the current silent bug.

 

[ERISLOVER]

Wasn't there a ROM that someone released, but had to take down because of this same exact issue. I'm only playing devils advocate here, but your phone is rooted, maybe that was the reason why?

No, that was because DialerOne had no backup to the default dialer because it was removed, to perform the emergency shortcut.

 

[ericFuels999]

To be perfectly honest, if you were rooted and running a custom ROM, HTC and Verizon have zero liability in this matter. You took the risk of hacking your phone at your sole discretion.

I love root just as much as the next person, and I absolutely hate that Verizon more or less has given the cold shoulder on bugs stemming from the 2.1 update, but we can't go blaming them for problems like this. If you were unrooted with a stock ROM, then I'd say you have a case.

 

[Barren]

I'm living with the silent bug right now.. I just avoid the camera app and it seems to be okay.. if I use camera, I immediately reboot, kill all the apps running a couple times, then run the calibrate on the g sensor and it's been doing okay.

edit: My phone was OTA updated.. never rooted at all.. It seems to have been awakened in the update, my phone had no issues prior to that. I think it's related to camera and g-sensor. I've managed to avoid issues since learning a reboot regiment.

 

[namu1107]

I think he has a case regardless. Verizon is WELL aware of the silent bug, on NON rooted phones, so they wouldn't be able to deny it. We as long as cableguynoe know well of that it was the silent bug, and not the root. Plus, there is a difference between the silence bug, and not being able to dial 911. If I understand correctly he was able to dial 911, just not hear anybody on the other end... hence the silent bug.

Its unfortunate...glad no one was hurt. Hope everything works out. Keep us updated

 

[Barren]

Just saw the Eris users rejoice thread... how soon till we all get the update?

 

[crandroid]

That's a really scary story. Unfortunately, I really doubt that anything will ultimately be done about it on Verizon's behalf. I'm sure that they have their ass covered in your contract with them, and there probably isn't any way that you can prove that it was a problem with them and not your phone.

Even if the accident had ended a lot worse than it did, I think that Verizon still wouldn't really care. They're a huge corporation that's out there to get as much money as they can. They only give a damn about consumer safety to the point where they can still sell phones and contracts. Still, get this story out there as much as possible.

 

[ericFuels999]

I think he has a case regardless. Verizon is WELL aware of the silent bug, on NON rooted phones, so they wouldn't be able to deny it. We as long as cableguynoe know well of that it was the silent bug, and not the root. Plus, there is a difference between the silence bug, and not being able to dial 911. If I understand correctly he was able to dial 911, just not hear anybody on the other end... hence the silent bug.

Its unfortunate...glad no one was hurt. Hope everything works out. Keep us updated

I understand it was due to the silent bug, but the device is restricted to running code signed by HTC. Regardless of whether the bug originated from an HTC ROM, the fact of the matter is the built-in security of the device was circumvented to run unsigned code, for which HTC nor Verizon should hold any liability.

Of course I'm going against the grain of this thread by holding this view, but enough is enough. While I agree that the bug is present in official ROMs, as I have experienced it myself, it is completely unreasonable to point the finger at the manufacturer when you didn't play by the rules of the end user agreement. Unfortunately, you don't have a case.

 

[ReJe75]

You guys are ridiculous, I am willing to be that none of you are willing to go into a VZW store and throw a tantrum and threaten a lawsuit because ...
1: You would not act that way in public
2: You know it wouldn't accomplish a thing

For the 1 or 2 of you that really would, the rest of us non-delusional people have seen you before and probably still tell the entertaining story about the psycho screaming at the phone sales guy about someone almost dying because their phone wouldn't work exactly as expected.

If it bothers you that the phone doesn't work properly take it back. I have been with Verizon 8 years and have only had one situation where I felt like I was dealt with unfairly. The rest of the time Verizon has gone above and beyond what I expected them to do. If you don't like the phone go ask what your options are, talk about the problems and see if they can fix or swap them out. (The trick here is to know which stores are full service stores and which are just sales outlets.) Full service have large stock of replacement, refurbs and have been more flexible with me in the past.

Go ahead flame me and quote a bunch of FCC regulations and premises for litigation, but just know that I think its crap and a little diplomacy will get you a lot further than raving about what might have happened in some life and death situation and throwing a tantrum to a store manager.

 

[Demache]

I understand it was due to the silent bug, but the device is restricted to running code signed by HTC. Regardless of whether the bug originated from an HTC ROM, the fact of the matter is the built-in security of the device was circumvented to run unsigned code, for which HTC nor Verizon should hold any liability.

Of course I'm going against the grain of this thread by holding this view, but enough is enough. While I agree that the bug is present in official ROMs, as I have experienced it myself, it is completely unreasonable to point the finger at the manufacturer when you didn't play by the rules of the end user agreement. Unfortunately, you don't have a case.

Even though the way Verizon is handling the silent bug is ridiculous, I have to agree that you could not sue them. Verizon and HTC have the money to hire very good lawyers who could play the "his device was modified, and therefore we cannot be held responsible for it" card. Since most people have no clue about bugs on the Eris, besides Verizon, HTC and Eris users themselves, they could get away with it real easily. Even though those who know better know its not the real cause. Unless someone got severely hurt or died, you can't sue. Even if that did happen, you would still have a hell of a time convincing the court otherwise.

 

[alprazolam]

Cableguy...do what your conscience allows. A lot of points, pro's and cons, but I think that the best course of action is to get the Moto Droid, if you can, or go to Verizon and try to make a case to upgrade to another maker's phone. Call 911 again. See if the same problem is replicated (the 911 dispatcher isn't going to come through the phone...just tell them that you are conducting a test after a failed attempt to call last night). If you don't get 911, take it to the store and call 911 in their presence. When they offer another Eris, simply tell them that you are part of a forum that has reported this sort of thing and that you refuse to go with another Eris.

The fact that your phone is rooted does pretty much kill any case that you would have, were there one in the first place.

Oh...and if you know that you are going to get rid of the Eris, unroot it and put stock 2.1 back on. That's also how you should test it before taking it up to Verizon.

 

[Frisco]

Call 911 again. See if the same problem is replicated (the 911 dispatcher isn't going to come through the phone...just tell them that you are conducting a test after a failed attempt to call last night).

Never, ever dial 911 unless it is to report an emergency.