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California Governor Jerry Brown vetoes Dem. approved budget because it doesn't raise taxes

Discussion in 'Politics and Current Affairs' started by FreakyLocz14, Jun 21, 2011.

  1. FreakyLocz14

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    Left-wing union bag boy Jerry Brown has vetoed a budget that passed both Houses of the Democratic-controlled California Legislature because it did not aise taxes on Californians, who currently pay some of the highest taxes in the nation.
    Jerry Brown vetoes budget - Democrats 'dismayed' - SFGate
     

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  2. 2strokenut

    2strokenut Well-Known Member
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    This is why California loses more residents than it gains every year.

    Shame, seems like the Dems and Reps finally compromised on something important only to get it vetoed.
     
  3. FreakyLocz14

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    California might lose one more here. I was born and raised here and it's a beautiful state, but the liberals who have been running it since 1970 have destroyed the state. Most of the state isn't that bad, but highly populated centers of batshit left-wing craziness like San Francisco, Alameda County, and to a lesser extent, Los Angeles County ruin it for everyone else.

    This budget was far from perfect, but it was still a hell of a lot better than what Brown was proposing.
     
  4. Vihzel

    Vihzel Destroying Balls Everyday
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    California's population grew by 10% from 2000 to 2010. I'm not sure how that equates to an overall loss of population.
     
  5. 2strokenut

    2strokenut Well-Known Member
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    I hear ya, I have family who lived in the SF bay area for years. They finally had enough and moved to Utah, and they're Liberal lol.
     
  6. Isthmus

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    You forget to mention the reasoning behind governor brown's veto, such as heavy reliance one time accounting gimmicks; shuffling moneys from one account to another in order to balance books; no true cost cutting or getting rid of underperformning state assets; and a continued reliance on major deficit spending to keep the government operational for decades to come.

    That was the real reason for the veto, and I don't think that askingthe state government to make real sacrifices inthe face of spending hat it cannot afford is reason to refer to teh governor as a "Left-wing union bag boy". If anything the type of fiscal policy he is asking for is very much "right wing" in style.
     
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  7. Vihzel

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    Since 1970, there have been 4 Republicans and 3 Democrats as governors of CA.
     
  8. FreakyLocz14

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    Brown has been a fierce supporter of the welfare state of California. I don't buy his change of heart facade one bit. He tried to get 4 Republican votes so that the tax hikes could be added to the budget, and that didn't happen.

    The real power rests with the California Legislature, which has been under consistent Democratic control since 1970 save a very brief period in the 1990's, when the Republicans had a narrow majority in the Assembly.
     
  9. 2strokenut

    2strokenut Well-Known Member
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    What are real sacrifices?

    Republicans can be liberal and Democrats can be conservative. The name doesn't mean anything. Last I checked the legislature has more of an impact on the state than a Governor. Check and see what the political makeup of the Cal state legislature has been the last 40 years.
     
  10. ElasticNinja

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    So you are saying you cant support a welfare state and be fiscally responsible :thinking:
    The most fiscally responsible states in the world (think Germany, Sweden, the Netherlands) all are strong welfare states.
     
  11. 2strokenut

    2strokenut Well-Known Member
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    Are you serious????
     
  12. FreakyLocz14

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    You can't in America We're a people that will vote someone out of office at even the slightest hint of raising taxes. Those states in Europe have insanely high taxes compared to even some of the most liberal areas of America. California's culture of underfunded entitlements are what caused our mess to begin with.
     
  13. ElasticNinja

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    [​IMG]

    All the states in that chart with low taxes (bar Switzerland) have serious economic issues
    You will have those "insanely high" taxes soon

    Yeah unfunded. Thats why they are raising taxes mate.
     
  14. FreakyLocz14

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    I don't really understand the point of that graph. What are you trying to prove by it?

    Taxes won't get raised here because the people will likely throw those that dare to do so out of office more quickly than they voted them in. Raising taxes is an extremely unpopular platform here.
     
  15. RiverOfIce

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    Let us visit two principals of budgets.

    1.) To stop gaining the debt, you need to stop spending.

    2.) To get out of debt, you need to make more money.

    You can not save your way out of debt. You can not cut back expenses to get out of debt. To get out of debt you need to make more money.

    The government will have to raise taxes. It will have to happen, if you want to get out of debt.

    If you think you can cut back spending and get out of debt, you have zero idea how a large budget works.

    Secondly, when you tax people higher, the economy grows.

    Oh you want proof. Here you go.

    http://img.ibtimes.com/www/data/ima...rt-showing-relationship-among-u-s-gdp-tax.jpg
    The lower the tax rate is the worst the gdp is.

    The republicans plan of no taxes has never and will never work. Look at the last huge recessions, who was president during the start of the recession?
     
  16. ElasticNinja

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    There is no place in the world where raising taxes is popular.
    My point was is he countries with "insanely high taxes" are not unsuccessful - they are actually better places to live and work than the US
     
  17. FreakyLocz14

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    Raising taxes isn't just unpopular here, it's outright hated with a deep passion.
     
  18. Isthmus

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    then answer this freakylocz. tax revenue in the US, at a federal level, right now is at a level on par with the early 1950's. at the same time US population has more than doubled, government expenses of all types have increased drastically. I'm not talking about spenditure in social programs, I'm talking about every day expenses such as road maintenance, salaries, healthcare costs, and of course the cost of the military. What I want to know is how exactly we should be able to maintain all these expenses at current levels with an ever decreasing tax base? I'm sure we can cut expenses drastically, but at what point is that no longer enough? who wants to live in the area where public schools are no longer supported by the state (and people are asked to pay, or god forbid, test in)? who wants to be the first to say, you know what, don't maintain the highway by my house, lets save money?

    See where I'm going with this? the answer is not many folks are willing to give up benefits of any kind.

    The problem is that economics doesn't care. if action is not taken to restructure the way government moneys are collected and spent, then the market will eventually make the decision for the government (as it is already starting to do).
     
  19. FreakyLocz14

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    The problem with California is not a revenue problem, it's a spending problem. This is a thread about the State of California, not the federal government.

    California has the highest total taxes on gas of any of the 50 states.
    http://www.advisor.com/blogs/richard-rider/california-leads-example-highest-gas-taxes-nation

    At 8.25%, California has the highest minimum state sales tax in the United States, which can total up to 10.75% with local sales tax included.
    Sales taxes in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The budget deal the Legislature reached today will keep California's top personal income tax rate and sales tax rate the highest in the Union.
    How California's income tax and sales tax rates compare - latimes.com

    There are state with much lower tax rates, yet they are better off economically. The problem is spending, not revenue.
     
  20. ElasticNinja

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  21. FreakyLocz14

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    Let's not further sway this thread off-topic to prove a point. High gas taxes are a good thing if your goal is to have high tax revenue. Whether or not they are good in general is a debate best saved for another thread.
     
  22. RiverOfIce

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    Which means something?

    You always need to balance taxes against GDP. California has the 8th largest economy in the WORLD. Not in the united states, but in the WORLD.

    Now if you compare % of taxes to income. You will get about $10.66 of income per 100 dollars. Which is slightly above the national average of $10.46 per 100 dollars. But is no where near the highest tax rate in the union, California is actually 6th in highest taxes, but still is the worlds 8th largest economy.

    If you look at averages, it is only 1.4% higher then the national average percentage.

    But california has always had a higher tax rate, but is still the 8th largest economy in the WORLD.

    No matter how you cut it, california is not utah.

    Let us but this into real numbers. The average tax payer in California makes 42,000 dollars a year. Pays about 10.5% of that in taxes.

    The average tax payer in utah makes about 30,000 dollars and pays only .9% less then a person making 10,000 dollars more.

    So cry me a river about high taxes. As soon as california slips out of the top ten in world economies, they can cry bloody murder.
     
  23. FreakyLocz14

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    The size of the state's economy does not have anything to do with the state of it or what effect tax rates have on it.
     
  24. Isthmus

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    Actually it does, as said size can be quantified in very real hard figures.
     
  25. FreakyLocz14

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    Our size has done little to fix the budget crisis we are in.
     

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