Had no clue how awesome a gyroscope in a phone was until I watched this...

[J03]

No one has pointed out the fact that this guy paid an extra $30 for that gyroscope... or was it just so he would have service when he held the phone?

 

[Bnice]

If there is one thing that the iPhone has better than pretty much any phone, is its polished interface. There's not a icon or menu that isn't thought through. Once you know how to go through menus in one of the native apps, you know how to use all of them.

Android Sense UI has a long way to go before it can get there. Some things are labeled "Options" some are "Settings". Sometimes you can use the menu button to get to them, sometimes you need to go into the Settings apps.

I read someone say that they liked this part of Android because it's for technical people and not for soccer moms. Really?

I love my Evo and I can never go back to a sub-4" screen again. But Android is playing catch up with the Apple interface and usability gurus.

I think you have ANDROID and SENSE UI mix up, now if another phone UI doesn't function like the iphone its subpar? please iphone since 2007 has been the same at one point it was oh i have a app for this now they can't say that all i hear now the iphone is sexy and polish its a good device but its not blowing away these new smart phones coming out.

 

[henryturk]

Can't this technically be emulated by the internal compass?

Edit: I didn't read any of this thread.

 

[ragebot]

I am of two minds about a gyroscope in a cell phone. Since I am not a pilot (not to mention possible technical issues) I don't see a real world use for it right now. Still there might be something developed that would interest me, just not sure what it is. I am a serious astronomer and find Google Sky very useful, but do notice the lag; I just do not notice it enough to worry about it. As Krusty the Klown says "It's not just good, its good enough."

Bottom line is right now a gyro in a cell phone seems like an answer in search of a question; something that may change in time.

 

[Minjin]

Problem number one is that people are saying that the gyroscope is the same as an accelerator but more accurate. This is dead wrong. They measure completely different things. The accelerometer measures acceleration and because we are in a gravity field, it can determine orientation. The gryroscope measures angular acceleration and can therefore determine rotation. Can you get one or the other by integrating the accelerometer's output or taking the derivative of the gyroscope's output? Somewhat. But it will never be as accurate as simply using the correct device. They both go hand in hand. Combine a 3 axis accelerometer with a 3 axis gryroscope and you get the so called 6 axis motion detection seen in stuff like the PS3 controllers. And no, a compass will give you neither.

The wikipedia pages on these two devices are good. For the people who actually want to learn, what don't you get?

 

[legacy]

It looks amazing, and will be in future phones. I love competition and how it pushes innovation. I see the iPhone stealing the Android-type notifications, and Android phones adding a gyro. If it weren't for these phones competing, we wouldn't have half the cool stuff we have now.

 

[jkr4577]

tx_brandon.. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE go buy either
A) Iphone 4
B) Moto Droid X
3) Epic4g

Then come back and start posts stating how cool either of the above three are greater than than the EVO. Stop sitting on that fence go ahead and take the plunge it would save us the time of watching you agonize over a electronic device thats useful for < 1 year before it becomes obsolete.

 

[IOWA]

it's a better accelorometer and that is it, it doesn't add more functionality and for a phone you don't need that kind of accuracy, so this is stupid

Exactly. Why everyone is acting like this is the second coming is beyond me. Show something you can do with this gyroscope, that I can't already do on my moment, then ill consider it useful. As cool as it is/sounds, I'd like to see some use for it before everyone goes gaga.

Tapatalk. Samsung Moment. Yep.

 

[MrX8503]

Problem number one is that people are saying that the gyroscope is the same as an accelerator but more accurate. This is dead wrong. They measure completely different things. The accelerometer measures acceleration and because we are in a gravity field, it can determine orientation. The gryroscope measures angular acceleration and can therefore determine rotation. Can you get one or the other by integrating the accelerometer's output or taking the derivative of the gyroscope's output? Somewhat. But it will never be as accurate as simply using the correct device. They both go hand in hand. Combine a 3 axis accelerometer with a 3 axis gryroscope and you get the so called 6 axis motion detection seen in stuff like the PS3 controllers. And no, a compass will give you neither.

The wikipedia pages on these two devices are good. For the people who actually want to learn, what don't you get?

it's a better accelorometer and that is it, it doesn't add more functionality and for a phone you don't need that kind of accuracy, so this is stupid

.

 

[Joppie]

Its a cool feature. The iPhone popularized touch screens when Blackberries were all the rage. Gyroscopes will be as standard in phones as micro-SD cards. Give it 6 months. The EVO 2 will have a gyroscope as well.

 

[Paul Heckbert]

... people are saying that the gyroscope is the same as an accelerator but more accurate. This is dead wrong. They measure completely different things. The accelerometer measures acceleration and because we are in a gravity field, it can determine orientation. The gryroscope measures angular acceleration and can therefore determine rotation...

Minjin is mostly correct.

Accelerometers measure acceleration in x, y, and z. Those can be accelerations because you're moving the phone around or acceleration due to gravity. The only time that the accelerometer would register (0,0,0) would be if it were in free fall. If you're holding the phone motionless, or holding it fixed in position and just rotating it, the dominant acceleration will be the one supporting the phone in opposition to gravity; an UP vector. From this you can calculate an elevation angle, but not an azimuth (angle around the up vector). Having a compass (magnetometer) could give you azimuth approximately.

The gyros used in phones are not spinning wheels, but rather microelectrical mechanical systems (MEMS) rate gyros typically of a tuning fork design. They measure angular velocity (not angular acceleration) -- how fast it is being rotated about the x, y, or z axis. It does not measure position or change in position at all. You could be moving at high speed or accelerating, but if you were holding the phone at a fixed orientation, the rate gyros would register (0,0,0).

If all you want to do is detect shaking, an accelerometer will do, but if you want coarse absolute control over pointing in 3D (which way is up? which way is north?), add a compass, and if you want fine relative control over pointing (pitch down 1 degree, yaw right 1 degree), a rate gyro helps a lot.

 

[colnelb]

Both the iPhone and the EVO have Micro Electronic Mechanical Systems (MEMS) accelerometers. The software for a MEMS accelerometer has to be programmed to exclude very fast movements to exclude "noise" and to exclude very slow movements to exclude the effects of gravity in some cases. The types of vibrational MEMS gyros that are in the iPhones do not have the requirement of the software filters. Because of the software filters, the accuracy and responsiveness of an accelerometer is relatively limited when compared to a MEMS gyro. Having both an accelerometer and a gyro will provide the best level of movement and orientation detection. I would like to see an EVO type phone with a gyro in addition to an accelerometer. Since both may be prior art before the days of smart phones, I don't see any reason for HTC not to include a gyro in their next version of the EVO.

 

[colnelb]

To add to my previous comment. Before there was GPS, there was "inertial guidance systems" (IGS) that were used to navigate by. IGS used a combination of accelerometers and gyros. The gyro would allow you to calculate which direction you were going and the accelerometers would allow you to calculate how far you have gone. At the time, IGS was the most accurate navigation system available. If properly set up, a good IGS could show you within a short distance where you were and what your altitude was. They continue to be used as backup navigation systems for some things.

The problem with gyros at the time, they had to spin up and stablize before they could be set and be reliable. The MEMS gyros used in the iPhones do not have that problem. With the new technology, IGS without the problems of the old technology are available, and in some cases, more accurate than the older systems.

With the proper app, all a pilot has to do is do a "set" when he first gets in his plane for it to provide navigation backup for him. I am not sure if the iPhone will be as accurate as a commercial/military IGS, but it should do in a "pinch". It would also be great for hikers and campers. With the solar flares that a coming in the next few years, effecting the GPS satellites, it would be good for anyone to have an IGS backup to their GPS. I would really like to see HTC have a gyro in their next phone. I am sure that someone will write an IGS app for it. I would be willing to provide financial support for such an app.

 

[ldominguez1986]

Just get a psp to play games. I'll keep my phone for calls messaging and internet thank you. Imo, a fail! If apple wants to 'compete' in gaming world then they need to make an igamer or something crappy to follow suit of their other products. Oh don't forget to hold it properly Lololol

Sent from my HTC Hero using Tapatalk

Man, what a bunch of haters on here. I love my evo but would i like it more it had a gyro yeah. Why not give credit where credit is do? When you show your phone to someone who is interested in it you tend to say it has this, that and the other thing. The OP is not saying wow I want an iPhone but he admires that feature as do I. If the evo or any other htc came with gyro would you still be dissing your phone, NO. It would just be one extra thing that made your smart phone better...

 

[EarlyMon]

Welcome to the forums - well said!

 

[EarlyMon]

To add to my previous comment. Before there was GPS, there was "inertial guidance systems" (IGS) that were used to navigate by. IGS used a combination of accelerometers and gyros. The gyro would allow you to calculate which direction you were going and the accelerometers would allow you to calculate how far you have gone. At the time, IGS was the most accurate navigation system available. If properly set up, a good IGS could show you within a short distance where you were and what your altitude was. They continue to be used as backup navigation systems for some things.

I used to work on those, up to the ring-laser gyro models.

Actually, the gyros had pick-ups on them that essentially provided raw accelerometer counts. Remember basic calculus - 1st derivative is velocity, 2nd is acceleration - so in reverse order - integrate accelerometer data once for velocity, integrate again for position change.

I'd not want to use any phone for inertial nav tho - the iPhone would require iTunes for some part of it, and the Evo would be displaying ads for businesses you were passing by. (j/k lol)

But - there's a lot of interesting games and apps that can benefit from a gyro, no doubt.

Glad you brought up MEMS. Here's a view of a MEMS gyro for those interested - iPhone 4 Gyroscope Teardown - iFixit

Here's an interesting Apple vid - it has Jobs doing the demo, so if anyone doesn't like him, don't watch -

YouTube - Apple iPhone 4 Gyroscope demo

 

[lordofthereef]

Here's the thing a lot of people are missing about the gyro... it will add customers that previously might not have considered it. More customers means a bigger mod and dev community. In the end, wether you use the gyro (or any other feature), the more feature packed the phone is, the better it is for everyone that owns the device.

 

[myriam]

Nobody mentioned it, but the EVO 3D has gyroscope.

 

[EarlyMon]

I recall seeing it's claimed to have accelerometers and a g-sensor, but haven't seen it claimed with a gyro.

 

[falk]

LG Optimus 3D has gyros; they're very impressive.

A few points: Although accelerometers measure acceleration and not rotation, they also give you a vector in the "up" direction thanks to the acceleration of the earth's gravity. Combine this with magnetic field information (compass), the device can determine its orientation in three dimensions. This in turn, means that the accelerometer and compass can give the device anything that the gyros can. More, actually, since the gyros give only rate of change while the accelerometers & compass give you absolute values.

However, the input from the accelerometers and compass produce a very jittery input. A good example of this would be Google Sky Map. This can be improved by filtering, but at the expense of lag.

What gyros give you is extreme smoothness and responsiveness. I've seen Google Sky Map running on an iPhone with gyros, and it was beautiful to watch in comparison to the accelerometer-only version.

 

[Vanquished]

The EVO 3D will have a gyroscope:

http://androidforums.com/htc-evo-3d/346198-htc-evo-3d-dummies.html#post2769970

 

[wolf_walker]

I had no idea how awesome a compass was till mine quit working.

 

[Huerfano]

To add to my previous comment. Before there was GPS, there was "inertial guidance systems" (IGS) that were used to navigate by. IGS used a combination of accelerometers and gyros. The gyro would allow you to calculate which direction you were going and the accelerometers would allow you to calculate how far you have gone. At the time, IGS was the most accurate navigation system available. If properly set up, a good IGS could show you within a short distance where you were and what your altitude was. They continue to be used as backup navigation systems for some things.

The problem with gyros at the time, they had to spin up and stablize before they could be set and be reliable. The MEMS gyros used in the iPhones do not have that problem. With the new technology, IGS without the problems of the old technology are available, and in some cases, more accurate than the older systems.

With the proper app, all a pilot has to do is do a "set" when he first gets in his plane for it to provide navigation backup for him. I am not sure if the iPhone will be as accurate as a commercial/military IGS, but it should do in a "pinch". It would also be great for hikers and campers. With the solar flares that a coming in the next few years, effecting the GPS satellites, it would be good for anyone to have an IGS backup to their GPS. I would really like to see HTC have a gyro in their next phone. I am sure that someone will write an IGS app for it. I would be willing to provide financial support for such an app.

There is a huge potential for a Backup navigation system for GPS given the instabilty both political and from solar flare interference. It looks as though the advent of gyroscopes and magnetic compasses will soon provide the developer the tools for at least a reasonably accurate navigation system based on the rectified images of stars and the sun&moon. The mathematical solution to working out a fix without identifying the actual heavenly body remains to be published. I am working on a prototype version of this. Unfortunately a lot of the code is in legacy Visual Basic.

Would love to meet up with someone who has the ability to spacially rectify images of the heavenly bodies

New member

 

[falk]

I implemented a pretty nice navigation package on Android that uses accelerometers, compass, gyros, and gps. My experience was that while the gyros are good enough to be used to stabilize a game, they drift far too much to be used for navigation.

I wrote a Kalman filter to combine the accelerometer input and gyro input to get a smooth output, but it still needs tuning. However, filter or no filter, I think the gyros will always drift too much to be used for navigation.

The accelerometers are worse, of course. Way too much jitter and noise. Remember that the gps, compass, accelerometers and gyros in a cell phone are designed to be as cheap as possible, not as accurate as possible.