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Marines urinating on dead enemy solders

T

TxGoat

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The video in the story is graphic in nature...viewer discretion advised..blah blah...

3rd party video below


U.S. general warns troops to treat dead with 'dignity and respect' - CNN.com

CNN said:
The deputy commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan ordered troops Friday to treat the corpses of slain insurgents and civilians with "appropriate dignity and respect."
The order follows a video that appears to show four U.S. Marines urinating on bodies, images that sparked swift condemnation from the United States and Afghanistan at a particularly crucial period in the U.S.-led war.
"We must treat the living and the dead with dignity and respect," Scaparrotti said in the directive, which was published Friday on the website of the NATO-led force in Afghanistan. He said troops must follow the rules of armed conflict and "act honorably at all times.
"In order to prevail, for the good of the coalition nations and the Afghan people, we can do no less."
The video surfaced as the United States and the Taliban have taken tentative steps toward peace negotiations and as the U.S. and its allies plan to withdraw troops by the end of 2014.
The general's directive instructed officers make sure subordinates know that they are obligated to report any allegations of misconduct involving corpses. He promised swift investigations and "appropriate actions" against offenders.
The directive notes that "defiling, desecrating, mocking, photographing or filming for personal use insurgent dead constitutes a grave breach" of the armed-conflict laws. It also violates "basic standards of human decency, and can cause serious damage to relations with the Afghan government."
The directive is dated Thursday, one day after a video surfaced online showing four men equipped with what a Marine official described as sniper gear urinating on what appeared to be the dead bodies of three men on the ground in front of them.
One of the men says, "Have a great day, buddy." A voice asks, "You got it on the video?" to which another voice responds, "Yeah." Another jokes, "Golden, like a shower."
It was not clear who shot or posted the 39-second video or where, though a U.S. official said it was a "reasonable conclusion" it was filmed in Afghanistan.
Military officials continued to investigate the video Friday.
Military officials have identified and interviewed two of four Marines depicted a Marine Corps official told CNN Friday. They expect the remainder to be identified today, the official said.
The Marines have been interviewed but not detained, the official said.
The names are not being made public, said the official, who did not want to be identified because the investigation is ongoing.
Officials in the United States and Afghanistan expressed shock and outrage regarding the video.
"I have seen the footage, and I find the behavior depicted in it utterly deplorable," U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta said in a statement. "I condemn it in the strongest possible terms."
While the identities of the people on the video haven't been released, the leadership of the 3rd Battalion 2nd Marine Regiment "is confident those are their Marines," according to a Marine official with direct knowledge of the initial investigation.
The official, based in Afghanistan, spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue.
The unit, which is based at Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, deployed last February or March and returned in September or October. While in Afghanistan, the unit was based primarily in Helmand province.
Panetta said he has ordered the Marine Corps and International Security Assistance Force Commander Gen. John Allen "to immediately and fully investigate the incident."
"This conduct is entirely inappropriate for members of the United States military and does not reflect the standards of values our armed forces are sworn to uphold," Panetta's statement said. "Those found to have engaged in such conduct will be held accountable to the fullest extent."
A senior Pentagon official said the video "deeply troubled" Panetta.
Marine Corps Commandant Gen. James Amos said in a statement the behavior is "wholly inconsistent with the high standards of conduct and warrior ethos that we have demonstrated throughout our history."
Lt. Gen. Adrian Bradshaw, deputy commander of NATO-led International Security Assistance Force, called the actions on the video "disgusting."
"Any acts which treat the dead, enemy or friendly, with disrespect are utterly unacceptable and do not represent the standards we expect of coalition forces," Bradshaw said in a video statement. He said he was speaking on behalf of Allen, who is out of the country.
"It is difficult to say what long-term impacts this might have, and I would hesitate to get into speculation, but obviously any sort of footage, any sort of activity of this kind that is grossly against all the moral values that the coalition forces are standing for are very much working against our cause and against everything that we are standing for and that we are here for," said Brig. Gen. Carsten Jacobson, a NATO ISAF spokesman. "We will find the ones who are responsible and hold them accountable."
A senior U.S. military official said the Naval Criminal Investigative Service is the lead investigative agency on the incident.
The official added that the desecration of a body by U.S. troops could be considered a potential war crime.
Amos said he has pulled together a team "to thoroughly investigate every aspect of the filmed event." He said he will also assign a Marine general officer and a senior attorney, both with combat experience, to conduct an internal preliminary inquiry into the matter.
"Once the investigation and preliminary inquiry are complete and the facts have been determined, then the Marine Corps will take the appropriate next steps," Amos said. "We remain fully committed to upholding the Geneva Convention, the laws of war and our own core values."
President Barack Obama knows about the video, said White House spokesman Jay Carney, who said he didn't know if Obama had viewed it.
"What it apparently depicts is deplorable, reprehensible and unacceptable," Carney said, adding the president agrees with Panetta's statement.
Afghan President Hamid Karzai called on the U.S. government to investigate the video and hand down the harshest punishment possible.
"The government of Afghanistan is deeply disturbed by a video that shows American soldiers desecrating dead bodies of three Afghans," according to a statement released by the presidential palace on behalf of Karzai.
"This act by American soldiers is simply inhuman and condemnable in the strongest possible terms."
A Taliban spokesman called the video "barbaric."
"And no religion that follows a holy text would accept such conduct. This inhuman act reveals their real face to the world," Taliban spokesman Qari Yousuf Ahmadi said via text message Thursday.
The video surfaces at a critical time for relations among the United States, the Afghan government and the Taliban.
Last year, the United States outlined its plan to withdraw its troops from Afghanistan, beginning by pulling out 33,000 "surge" troops who had been deployed to help quell the violence by the end of 2012. The remaining 68,000 troops would be withdrawn by the end of 2014.
Meanwhile, the Taliban tentatively agreed in recent weeks to open an office in Qatar's capital city of Doha, a decision widely seen as an overture aimed at establishing an outside forum for political talks with NATO-led forces and the current Afghan administration, among others.


I've seen some argue that the Taliban's "barbaric behavior" gives them no right to question the behavior of our soldiers and I completely agree. However, our soldiers do need to answer to the integrity and values that each branch of military has established, and the actions of these Marines does not reflect well on those standards. I do hope all involved (even the cameraman) are disciplined and maybe even dishonorably discharged for this behavior. These guys do a disservice to EVERY service member that risks their lives with the integrity and valor that our military has built on.
 
I agree it shows little respect, but who gives a rats red rump about them, anyway. I mean we put bullets into their brains and I think that is a bigger "insult" than peeing on them.

I think those that did this uncouth thing will be punished and that is how it should be. You break the rules and you pay the price. I am not sure this is the crime of the century and I am sure many a solder has defiled the enemy.

Sad thing is, many will simply assume all soldiers behave this way.

By the way, George Patton was photographed peeing in the Rhine River. Nothing new, just too bad the soldiers were caught. If they go to the brig there will be fewer soldiers out there killing the bustardos.
 
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Soldiers who feel like its OK to murder people and pose with their bodies and urinate on them should be murdered and disrespected. Or at least told to live in another country.

Now that is just silly. Are you kidding me?

Soldiers that break the laws, the rules, the UCMJ should be tried and if convicted, sent to jail and then dishonorably discharged.

Not sure if convicted they can be told to vacate the U.S. of A.
 
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The only "good" this act caused was none. Instead it incited in the enemies more fervor to want to retaliate in one way or another.

What theyve done in this video was Senseless.

I am a soldier and have been there. I would like to thank you for your words they are right on. Anyone who thinks its ok to piss on a dead person is a total idiot. Its that exact attitude that makes the world hate us. Its embarrassing and part of our culture that needs to change.
 
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well of course it was senseless, do you really expect the soldiers we send over there to defend us to have a lot of "sensible" actions against the people they are shooting every day and being killed from? i don't. personally i think it was wrong, yes, but since when was war and killing people over ideals sensible?

you have to stop thinking these soldiers live like normal citizens... they don't, they live in total hell, bullets whizzing past them like mosquitoes all the time, THEY LIVE IN WAR, WE DO NOT, i really don't think that we are in a place to judge them whether it was right or wrong.

now if a normal citizen just pissed on a homeless guy, yes i would understand the "disgust" but these men and women save our lives, our country and our future and live in a reality we do not, i don't think anyone here has the right to tell them what they did was wrong even if it was unless you have carried a rifle over seas and lived their life.

....so, what "you've" posted gives them and any ome.else the right to.piss on a grave....
Lets.see if our U.S. Govt agree with that thought. I doubt it
 
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I think it's a good thing that so many people are outraged about this. As they should be. We (America) like to think we're the best. And, by a lot of tallies, we are. So that's why we can proudly fly the flag. We don't have to hide in caves. We don't have to hide behind women and children and use them as human shields. We don't have to use children as soldiers.

And that's why this is so disgraceful. We, as a nation, are supposed to be at a higher standard. When I served and we were overseas, we were held at a higher standard. And I bet that those soldiers who pissed on the enemy dead sure as hell wouldn't want any of their soldiers pissed on after they were killed by enemy action. They'd probably get pissed off, too!
 
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I think for a big part, we as a nation have moved on from the tragedy that was 9/11 (in no way am I making light of it or suggesting it wasn't the worst terrorist attack against America). I guess what I mean is that the whole Bush era of we need to kill these guys and we need to rile every American up to do it is coming to an end.
Abu Ghraib was an absolute nightmare and I'm glad we acted with the disgust as we did. This is still quite insensible and I'm glad Americans are realizing, hey, the war on terror has at least quieted down and we need to act as the most respected stewards in both combat and image in the world.
This is simply a step backwards IMO.
 
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Covert_Death, I do understand what you are saying and you are right. But the problem that this is a highly political and diplomatic war where there are things we want to do to them for what unmerciful acts theyve done to innocent ones in NY and other parts of the world....as a country, we have to hold a highr ground and hold our reactions so not to compromise our just cause.

Its hard not to do somethimg when we have that day burned into our heart and mind....i know you are right...but as you see, when we do these things we are called out by the world....
 
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Things like this have occurred in war since literally the beginning of time. It's nothing new and it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be. Have we forgotten about murdering innocent native American women and children in our own country? What about WW2 or Vietnam? Do you really think the enemy wasn't going to try to kill us before? That we've been at war this whole time and they haven't been pissed until we pissed on a couple dead bodies?

One of my friend's dad is a vietnam vet and he put it best. "I saw on the news about people all up in arms about these soldiers pissin on a couple of the enemy's dead... I wonder what these people woulda thought if they'd seen a man hangin on the side of the trail with his gentials cut off and stuck in his mouth. And much worse. This ain't shit. We're in a war people, this ain't Kindergarten."

Now I'm not saying its right. I'm just saying it happens and this particular offense isn't even close to as big of a deal as they're making it out to be.
 
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Everyone seems to be pointing at what the Taliban does in an attempt to justify this act. We can't compare ourselves to an enemy that believes in burning down schools that teach women, or believes it is right to throw acid on women. This is about the standard of being a U.S. soldier, not the standard of doing things the way our enemies do things. I don't really care that it offends the people of Afghanistan so much that it goes against the dignity and the honor of being a service member in the U.S. military. As far as the Tea Bagger politician from FL, aside from the fact that he's a nutjob, YES war is hell, no that doesn't give combatants a license to behave like animals. Hopefully, the rest of our troops can stay strong because as Rico pointed out, this act is only going to help our enemies reforge their hatred and help recruit more people to their cause.
 
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Things like this have occurred in war since literally the beginning of time. It's nothing new and it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be. Have we forgotten about murdering innocent native American women and children in our own country? What about WW2 or Vietnam? Do you really think the enemy wasn't going to try to kill us before? That we've been at war this whole time and they haven't been pissed until we pissed on a couple dead bodies?

One of my friend's dad is a vietnam vet and he put it best. "I saw on the news about people all up in arms about these soldiers pissin on a couple of the enemy's dead... I wonder what these people woulda thought if they'd seen a man hangin on the side of the trail with his gentials cut off and stuck in his mouth. And much worse. This ain't shit. We're in a war people, this ain't Kindergarten."

Now I'm not saying its right. I'm just saying it happens and this particular offense isn't even close to as big of a deal as they're making it out to be.
I agree. Not politically correct, but true.
 
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Catch 22

Catch-22 also catch-22 (kchtwn-t-t, kch-)
n.
1.
a. A situation in which a desired outcome or solution is impossible to attain because of a set of inherently illogical rules or conditions: "In the Catch-22 of a closed repertoire, only music that is already familiar is thought to deserve familiarity" (Joseph McLennan).
b. The rules or conditions that create such a situation.
2. A situation or predicament characterized by absurdity or senselessness.
3. A contradictory or self-defeating course of action: "The Catch-22 of his administration was that every grandiose improvement scheme began with community dismemberment" (Village Voice).
4. A tricky or disadvantageous condition; a catch: "Of course, there is a Catch-22 with Form 4868you are supposed to include a check if you owe any additional tax, otherwise you face some penalties" (New York).

catch-22
n
1. a situation in which a person is frustrated by a paradoxical rule or set of circumstances that preclude any attempt to escape from them
2. a situation in which any move that a person can make will lead to trouble
 
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These guys are idiots, not because of what they did but by putting it on the internet.

In the early days of the war, you know when it was fun and we had the element of surprise. We would put pork in the mouths of the Taliban we killed, we would soak tampons in their blood and wipe them on their faces, and crudely shave their beards off. The tampons might seem a little vague, whoever found them had no idea who killed them, but its some old religious law not to touch a woman while menstruating.

It might sound sadistic, but we did it for the reason of demoralizing the enemy. We would even go as far as to interrogate a prisoner while claiming the fresh meat were eating was their comrades that we cook in pig fat. Normally it was just hunks of pork, we never ate anyone, their quite undernourished there. Then he would "escape", go back and tell all his buddies how evil we were.

Know what our actions got us? $10,000 bounty to anyone who could bring back one of our heads. $20,000 if alive. As we always left our calling cards behind so they knew who killed their friends. Showing your enemy they are less than human is what keeps them in fear and you from losing control.

Like I said before, these Marines should be punished for being stupid. Not for urinating.
 
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This is not right at all. Imagine how upset we'd be if this was our troops being disgraced like this. This is definitely unacceptable. That being said, I don't know if I can say this is 'worse' than killing a person. I just don't really see the point, and I think these people were not clearly thinking (especially when they decided to film it).

I am mostly worried about any consequences that this could have. I'm sure it will have enemy forces and citizens upset about this, and more attacks on troops. It also casts the armed forces in a bad light, which is not needed at all. These men and women are doing a service to their country and deserve our respect... even though this action is not a respectable one, these people are still doing a respectable thing by serving, and I think that is the important thing here.
 
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These guys are idiots, not because of what they did but by putting it on the internet.

In the early days of the war, you know when it was fun and we had the element of surprise. We would put pork in the mouths of the Taliban we killed, we would soak tampons in their blood and wipe them on their faces, and crudely shave their beards off. The tampons might seem a little vague, whoever found them had no idea who killed them, but its some old religious law not to touch a woman while menstruating.

I do not believe you.
 
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Ladies and Gentlemen, I felt that now would be the perfect opportunity to not only keep my mouth shut, but to share with you the feelings of someone very qualified on the subject! Instead of weighing in with my own opinions based on some emotion or bravado or national pride, I decided to weigh in with the opinion of my childhood friend and career Marine (active duty) with the rank of Colonel. These are his words, verbatim:

" I have seen a lot of posts and comments from folks wanting to defend the Marines that were apparently shown on the video urinating on the dead Taliban. I know and am thankful so many Americans want to give their Marines the benefit of the doubt and not 'blame' them for their actions. Thank you all for your support but in this case as it appears right now, these Marines do not deserve a pass. The truth is this: Marines are better than that, period. Does our enemy offer our dead or wounded the same courtesy? No, but that doesn't mean we lower our standards of conduct as professional warriors, Marines, and as Americans. As Marines we hold ourselves and each other to the highest standards and we will not tolerate anyone that jeopardizes our mission or tarnishes the honor of the Corps. I am sure it broke the heart of the Commandant as it broke mine that the SecDef and SecState had to apologize for these Marines actions. But while they are in some hot water, these Marines will be treated fairly. They will have all their rights under the UCMJ protected and if found guilty, held accountable. So while I am sure all Marines appreciate the support, there is no excuse for this kind of action. We owe you better. Semper Fidelis"
 
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