To sue or not to sue?

MoodyBlues · Apr 11, 2013

I'd like opinions on something I've been struggling with. I'm not doing this as a poll because I want actual input on why you're for or against the idea. Okay, here goes...

If you've followed my long and emotional saga regarding my mother's death, you're already aware of what happened with the mortuary. If you haven't been following, here's the very short version: When they came to take my mom's body, they asked me if I wanted the shirt she was wearing returned to me, and I said "definitely." They hand wrote those instructions on a document, then handed it to me to sign, and I did. When we went to pick up Mom's ashes--AND the shirt--the shirt was nowhere to be seen. Turns out it was inadvertently cremated with Mom. I was actually speechless when the funeral director told me that. ME! speechless! :eek:

They've apologized up and down, told my husband that as a result of realizing what they'd done they had a long staff meeting [to discuss it and make sure it doesn't happen again], and so on. But none of that brings back Mom's shirt. I wanted it back. It was really important to me. And THEY'RE the ones who asked about it in the first place. When they did that, it led me to believe that this is part of their routine, just a normal, common thing they deal with all the time.

I don't know what to do. The more time that passes, the angrier everybody in my life is getting about this. I'm hurt...disappointed...sad...but I wouldn't say ANGRY. I may still be too numb from losing my mom, but I don't know.

So my question is, should I sue them? That's what everybody in my [real] life seems to be getting at. They're saying "they should compensate you somehow! they need to pay for this! it's inexcusable--they need to be held accountable!" I just don't know. I'm not a litigious person at all, and while I'm EXTREMELY saddened by what they did, I don't really know that suing them would be the right thing to do, or that it would be effective in teaching them a lesson. But...on the other hand...they royally screwed up. And there are no do-overs in a situation like this--nothing can be done to bring that shirt back.

Finally, the state's Cemetery and Funeral Bureau has provisions for filing complaints. I'll probably do that, but suing...I'm not so sure. What would you do? What do you think I should do?

9to5cynic · Apr 11, 2013

I'm really sorry this happened to you moody. As far as the lawsuit goes, I'm really not sure. I really don't have much experience with something like this, but what about a compromise? Say the funeral home has to donate $XXX to a specific charity?

I'm not really sure, and whatever happens, I'm sure you'll make the right choice for you and yours.

-9to5

ParishL31 · Apr 11, 2013

First off, sorry for your loss and hope things will start getting brighter for you soon.

Next, to the original subject. You have to weigh the costs vs benefit of it. Not only the money it will cost for a lawyer, but also the hassle and time that will come with it. I'm not a law expert so this may be wrong, but I do not see you being able to get much money out of this, considering you do win.

The best case scenario is you win. Probably a small amount of money (again just my guess). But the real win is "revenge" and hurting the people that hurt you by mistake.

Worst case scenario is you lose the court case, lose all the money you put into hiring a lawyer, and then be forced to pay for their court costs too. You'd be infinitely more upset at that point.

In my opinion, it's not worth pursuing. I know my answer is not the one you want to hear especially in the state you are in now. I can't even imagine how angry I would be put in the same situation, but I don't think it'd be worth pursuing, time or money.

Again, sorry for your loss though.

sleedeane · Apr 11, 2013

Nothing will bring the shirt back.
What money do they owe you, pain and suffering?
Just drop it.

damewolf13 · Apr 11, 2013

I am not a lawyer so I don't know for sure what your grounds would be.
As for the shirt, even if you could get a monetary value placed on it, it would never be able to replace the sentimental value you attach to it, so that won't ease your pain.
It seems that they already have recognized the magnitude of their mistake, and have taken action to ensure it is not repeated.
I personally believe that a lawsuit would just make your healing even harder and slower at this time, and I can't believe that is what your Mom would have wanted.
Remember the good times, and let your heart heal gently, and without this added frustration. JMO.

Granite1 · Apr 11, 2013

MB, I can't attempt to say I understand your loss. I still have my folks, lost my little sister a while back, but not my mum.

I understand they screwed up, so do they. It was a mistake, worst part is, the sentimental item is forever gone. Does the item embody your mom? I don't know. Your hurting, I know that, but do you need to prolong that hurt?

I'd say let it go. No need to drag it out, start the healing. Forgive and forget. Remember the happy things you did with your mum, the hell with the rest.

I'm really am sorry MB.

huh · Apr 11, 2013

I really don't think you should sue..It will only serve to prolong your pain..and although this negligence no doubt is making it difficult for you to find closure

Your Mom is.. and always will.. be with you...

my suggestion would be to plant a tree... in her honor...nurture it and watch it grow

I'm so sorry for your loss...

MoodyBlues · Apr 11, 2013

Thanks for the great replies so far. They're exactly the type of dialogue I was hoping for. And thanks, too, for the kind words.

huh said:
my suggestion would be to plant a tree... in her honor...nurture it and watch it grow

Funny you should mention that! I had already planned on taking some of Mom's ashes and putting them in the ground, here on the property she lived in for 40 years, and then planting a rose bush on top of them. She loved roses. So that was going to happen this summer anyway--when I get everybody here to do the scattering of her ashes at the beach. (I don't want to open the box containing her ashes until then. I don't think I could handle seeing her that way right now.) But! My best friend, when discussing the mortuary screw up the other day, suggested asking the mortuary to plant a memorial garden in my mom's honor. Something beautiful, perhaps with a bench with her name on it--putting it somewhere the staff would routinely have to pass by.

In other words, let it honor my mom but also act as a reminder not to screw up again. What does everybody think about that idea?

I hope I got across in my OP that suing really isn't my cup of tea, but I also want to underscore that I understand no amount of money will replace the sentimental value of the shirt that was cremated. If I sued, it would be more about making a point than making a mint.

In fact, if you look back at the thread about my mom's death, I mentioned suing them for $1 just to make a point--so it really isn't about money.

Gmash · Apr 11, 2013

I have to agree with the others, it was a human error, nothing can be done about it now. Save yourself the time and aggravation, accept their apology and move on. Your love and memories are what's important, and nobody can take those away from you.

ocnbrze · Apr 11, 2013

i agree MB with the others as much as i would like to say yes to suing them, i think that it is best to just move on. i'm sure that your mom would say that it was just a shirt and it is nothing important enough to go thru the trouble of getting a lawyer involved. plus by the time you have to take it to court, you will have to relive the memory of losing your mom all over again.

i understand it is not about the money and that they are wrong in what they did. but i think you should move on.....think on what your mom would say and go with that.

take care MB

edit: yeah i missed the idea about the garden. i think that is a great idea as well.

damewolf13 · Apr 11, 2013

I actually think the memorial garden is a great idea.

I don't know if they would be willing to do that, but it can't hurt to ask.

saptech · Apr 11, 2013

I agree with the others, pass on suing. Some type of memorial would be nice.

huh · Apr 11, 2013

MoodyBlues said:
Thanks for the great replies so far. They're exactly the type of dialogue I was hoping for. And thanks, too, for the kind words.

Funny you should mention that! I had already planned on taking some of Mom's ashes and putting them in the ground, here on the property she lived in for 40 years, and then planting a rose bush on top of them. She loved roses. So that was going to happen this summer anyway--when I get everybody here to do the scattering of her ashes at the beach. (I don't want to open the box containing her ashes until then. I don't think I could handle seeing her that way right now.) But! My best friend, when discussing the mortuary screw up the other day, suggested asking the mortuary to plant a memorial garden in my mom's honor. Something beautiful, perhaps with a bench with her name on it--putting it somewhere the staff would routinely have to pass by. In other words, let it honor my mom but also act as a reminder not to screw up again. What does everybody think about that idea?

I hope I got across in my OP that suing really isn't my cup of tea, but I also want to underscore that I understand no amount of money will replace the sentimental value of the shirt that was cremated. If I sued, it would be more about making a point than making a mint. In fact, if you look back at the thread about my mom's death, I mentioned suing them for $1 just to make a point--so it really isn't about money.

The Rose bushes sound so beautiful ...and fitting!...

I think you will find that in time...they will bring you both..
a connection , harmony....joy and peace

..

Speed Daemon · Apr 12, 2013

Gmash said:
I have to agree with the others, it was a human error, nothing can be done about it now. Save yourself the time and aggravation, accept their apology and move on. Your love and memories are what's important, and nobody can take those away from you.

The funeral home that prepared my dad after he died made some mistakes, like parting his hair on the wrong side. I don't remember the other mistakes, but when I pointed them out, they were VERY apologetic and tried to change my dad's part while he was in the coffin, which only made things worse. The clearly rattled staff then went on to close the coffin without removing the jewelry and glasses that my mom wanted to keep. (Who puts glasses on a corpse in the first place?) So the funeral procession was held up as they rolled the casket into a back room and retrieved the items.

I was only 15 at the time, so I couldn't have done anything even if I had wanted to. Mostly I felt bad for the people who had made the mistakes. I never had any doubt that they were trying to do the best job possible, and that's all that mattered to me. Sure the viewing and funeral procession had a couple of hiccups, so what?

If that had happened today, I probably would have made a slight effort to get a couple bucks off their fee or some other instant gratification, but wouldn't want to carry it any farther along in time than that day. I had enough to occupy my mind at the time.

MoodyBlues · Apr 12, 2013

Speed Daemon said:
The funeral home that prepared my dad after he died made some mistakes, like parting his hair on the wrong side. I don't remember the other mistakes, but when I pointed them out, they were VERY apologetic and tried to change my dad's part while he was in the coffin, which only made things worse. The clearly rattled staff then went on to close the coffin without removing the jewelry and glasses that my mom wanted to keep.

Oh, dear.

(Who puts glasses on a corpse in the first place?)

I understand it's very common to put glasses on the...departed...if they normally wore glasses.

So the funeral procession was held up as they rolled the casket into a back room and retrieved the items.

I was only 15 at the time, so I couldn't have done anything even if I had wanted to. Mostly I felt bad for the people who had made the mistakes. I never had any doubt that they were trying to do the best job possible, and that's all that mattered to me. Sure the viewing and funeral procession had a couple of hiccups, so what?

That's a very philosophical way of looking at it.

If that had happened today, I probably would have made a slight effort to get a couple bucks off their fee or some other instant gratification, but wouldn't want to carry it any farther along in time than that day. I had enough to occupy my mind at the time.

That's kind of where I am, but since my mom had long ago pre-paid the mortuary, I can't ask for 'a couple bucks off their fee,' because there is no fee, it was all paid for years ago.

I think I said in the other thread that, as was your impression with your dad, the folks at the mortuary seem GENUINELY and VERY apologetic about the screw up. In fact, the funeral director told my husband that she's embarrassed by it. We don't doubt the sincerity of their apologies or anything, but I keep wondering if that's enough. If I had to give an answer right now...I do believe I'd go with "don't sue...it's not worth it emotionally and won't bring the shirt back."

Speed Daemon · Apr 12, 2013

MoodyBlues said:
That's a very philosophical way of looking at it.

I get that a lot. :hmmmm:

I do believe I'd go with "don't sue...it's not worth it emotionally and won't bring the shirt back."

That's probably the best choice.

If in doubt, give it time, say three months. If you still feel the same way after three months, do what you need to do. If you're over it by then, then live and let live...

danaj · Apr 12, 2013

I have gone through something similar. My son was murdered by his father almost 8 years ago. I had wanted a lock of his hair, and the baby blanket that was taken as "evidence". I was told they would make sure I got a lock of hair, but that I wouldn't get the blanket because they would keep it always as evidence. My son was cremated before I was able to get a lock of his hair. I just let it go. People make mistakes, and bringing more negativity to the situation wouldn't have done anyone good. Also in the 2 months before my son was murdered, I called the police on my husband 4 times because he was being violent towards me. I asked the officers if they could help me get in a battered women's shelter, they called the shelter, and they said they would take me, but I needed a police report. The officers didn't want to give me a police report, and I was unable to go to the shelter. The day my son was murdered I was being interrogated by the police, and the detective said "So you knew your husband could be violent, and you did nothing about it?!" I told him that I had called the police 4 times in the previous 2 months hoping they would help me, but they wouldn't even wright me a report to get into the shelter. The detective said that he didn't even know about my calls. I would have thought that the officers would have come forward to tell the detective that they had been out to my house 4 times, but they didn't. Many people have told me that I should sue the police department, however I realize that those men made a mistake in not taking my complaints seriously, and suing them would not bring my son back. I just hope that those men learned that they should take domestic violence complaints seriously.

I just feel that the healthiest thing to do is just keep moving forward. Also the memorial tree or garden sounds nice.

MoodyBlues · Apr 12, 2013

danaj said:
I have gone through something similar. My son was murdered by his father almost 8 years ago.

I'm so sorry. That's beyond horrible.

I had wanted a lock of his hair, and the baby blanket that was taken as "evidence". I was told they would make sure I got a lock of hair, but that I wouldn't get the blanket because they would keep it always as evidence. My son was cremated before I was able to get a lock of his hair. I just let it go. People make mistakes, and bringing more negativity to the situation wouldn't have done anyone good.

Good points.

Also in the 2 months before my son was murdered, I called the police on my husband 4 times because he was being violent towards me. I asked the officers if they could help me get in a battered women's shelter, they called the shelter, and they said they would take me, but I needed a police report. The officers didn't want to give me a police report, and I was unable to go to the shelter. The day my son was murdered I was being interrogated by the police, and the detective said "So you knew your husband could be violent, and you did nothing about it?!" I told him that I had called the police 4 times in the previous 2 months hoping they would help me, but they wouldn't even wright me a report to get into the shelter. The detective said that he didn't even know about my calls. I would have thought that the officers would have come forward to tell the detective that they had been out to my house 4 times, but they didn't. Many people have told me that I should sue the police department, however I realize that those men made a mistake in not taking my complaints seriously, and suing them would not bring my son back.

You're right, it wouldn't bring your son back, but it WOULD put the police department on notice that domestic violence complaints should not be taken lightly.

I just hope that those men learned that they should take domestic violence complaints seriously.

I hope so, too. But if the department had had to pay a huge lawsuit settlement, I suspect the point would've been driven home rather decisively. There's just something about losing a lot of money that makes an impression.

I just feel that the healthiest thing to do is just keep moving forward.

I think so, too. But I'm still open to hearing for and against thoughts.

Also the memorial tree or garden sounds nice.

Agreed!

zuben el genub · Apr 12, 2013

I'd also say pass on the suing. It will only prolong the grief and make it harder in the end.

What I would do - if you have a good picture of your mother in the shirt, get it redone professionally. Even a picture of the shirt. A good Photoshopper could recreate the shirt.

Failing that type of portrait - try to find one that brings back good memories especially the scent of flowers, the sound of the wind, the light the day the photo was taken. Have that done as a portrait. That's a happy memory you can keep forever.

pbf98 · Apr 12, 2013

No amount of money can bring back what they took from you. Sueing will not be of much help in this situation. Everyone makes mistakes, some bigger than others, there should still be some accountability for them, but that could be as simple as a formal apology and the assurance that it won't happen to the next person. You may not know that person, but helping others is still a good thing.
And if the shirt was for memory dedicate an annual thing to her memory, go out and do something she enjoyed doing, prepare a special meal in her memory, plant her favorite flowers. Once a year there is a fund raiser in my last girlfriends memory that raises money to go towards scholarships to help students that share the same interests she had fulfill their hopes to continue their education. And after the fundraiser I go out with her parents to spend time with them.
There are many ways to keep your mothers memories alive, sueing is not one of them. I hope you can find a way to keep her memory alive in a way that is special to you.

LilBit · Apr 12, 2013

Hi MB, this is just a little something you already know.

Romaji: Fuku sui bon ni kaerazu
Literally: Overturned water doesn't return to the tray
Meaning: What's done is done;

MoodyBlues · Apr 12, 2013

zuben el genub said:
What I would do - if you have a good picture of your mother in the shirt, get it redone professionally. Even a picture of the shirt. A good Photoshopper could recreate the shirt.

I'm quite the shutterbug, taking lots of pictures, even for mundane everyday stuff. So there's a CHANCE I may have a pic of Mom in that shirt that I don't know about right now, but may turn up if I start looking through my pics.

I do...well...I do have several pics of her in it...that I took after she died. Not exactly the stuff portraits are made of.

Failing that type of portrait - try to find one that brings back good memories especially the scent of flowers, the sound of the wind, the light the day the photo was taken. Have that done as a portrait. That's a happy memory you can keep forever.

I've kind of done that, not as a portrait yet, but I printed out a pic taken last summer when my whole family came. We got Mom out into the backyard [in her wheelchair] so she could see the yard from the opposite side--seeing it from the patio doors is nice, but BEING out there amongst the flowers and trees was special. She loved gardening, as do I, so this was special. We got everybody in front of a huge flower bed I started last spring, with all the flowers in full bloom, and took pics. So I took the photo I printed and put it on the wall in her bedroom. Even though I rarely go in there now, it's a nice touch.

To sue or not to sue?

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